What I Think Makes A Good World

[Firaga 5,947]

Back when I was still fairly new to the site, I used to do threads about world ideas that I personally thought would be a bad fit for Kingdom Hearts III and Kingdom Hearts in general.

 

It was also around the time where I did this thing where I would basically abuse the font options and really dress up whatever I was saying, but I've grown out of that.

 

But anyways, I was thinking about bringing that back (the threads, not the other thing) in order to comment on more recent ideas for worlds as well as some already confirmed for the game, but then I decided I should just clarify exactly what I believe and why I believe as it applies to new worlds in general just so that it's easier to understand my overall mentality when discussing this subject.

 

So let me attempt to make this as simple as I can: the only real criteria I have for a new world is that it feels like a natural pick for the universe that is Kingdom Hearts. In turn, for that to happen, it has feel unnatural as well. Confused yet? I'll continue:

 

A good idea for a world, in my opinion, is that is has to have a a fish-out-of-water scenario that correlates with the idea that Sora (or whoever the protagonist is really) is experiencing something that he would never experience on his home world, or any other world for that matter, and more importantly one that defies normal standards and presents the player with a sense of mysticism and fairy tale-esque spectacle, which can qualify for pretty much any world that's already been used in Kingdom Hearts because they all follow this standard. Every world is set in fantasy, and even if its  based in the real world, it's counteracted with enough fantasy (such as a supernatural aid or by being set in a different time period with a unique culture) to make it work all the same.

 

That's why I would be absolutely appalled if Zootopia or something similar to that would be used as a world because it misses the point entirely. There's no mysticism or spectacle in a property like that. Yeah, everybody's a talking animal but that idea in general isn't all that great on its own for one thing, and even then, it's still too close to real life. Anything too close to real life in general gets an automatic "NO" from me, but I'm sure I've made that obvious by this point.

 

Now, I know what you're thinking: does that mean I'm against Big Hero 6 too? Well, no actually, I'm not. I do have my worries as it is still very close to real life and there could be ways of taking that too far in terms of how it's presented but as long as its done gracefully, I won't have a problem with it.

 

Hopefully I've gotten the idea across because I really didn't want to write blocks of text when I can just try to make things easier to digest.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Firaga Sensei

[lehahiah81 60]

I can easily understand where you're coming from with the close to reality thing, and I have this problem with a few worlds, but another problem of mine is drastically different art styles although this is mostly just a problem with tv shows which I'm not really that worried about them being included.

 

 

Example of strange cross over is the lilo and stitch/american dragon/kim possible(just looked weird)

[Dr. Gauntlet 5]

Treasure Planet

 

Also isn't Tarzan more realistic than Zootopia? Yet that worked well.

[Firaga 5,947]

Also isn't Tarzan more realistic than Zootopia? Yet that worked well.

 

Yes, but it's still fantasy because of how it fits into the time period/culture spectrum I mentioned.

 

Like, we know that it's set in the real world and in the movie England is referenced, but that's not how it was handled in Kingdom Hearts 1. It stayed in the junglescape, the environment worked around it for the entirety of its structure, with things even added in like the Cavern of Hearts, the circumstances are the plot aren't ordinary whether it be the game or the original film, and Jane and Clayton being from England is never referenced directly.

Edited April 15, 2016 by Firaga Sensei

[Hero of Light XIV 2,381]

 

Back when I was still fairly new to the site, I used to do threads about world ideas that I personally thought would be a bad fit for Kingdom Hearts III and Kingdom Hearts in general.

 

It was also around the time where I did this thing where I would basically abuse the font options and really dress up whatever I was saying, but I've grown out of that.

 

But anyways, I was thinking about bringing that back (the threads, not the other thing) in order to comment on more recent ideas for worlds as well as some already confirmed for the game, but then I decided I should just clarify exactly what I believe and why I believe as it applies to new worlds in general just so that it's easier to understand my overall mentality when discussing this subject.

 

So let me attempt to make this as simple as I can: the only real criteria I have for a new world is that it feels like a natural pick for the universe that is Kingdom Hearts. In turn, for that to happen, it has feel unnatural as well. Confused yet? I'll continue:

 

A good idea for a world, in my opinion, is that is has to have a a fish-out-of-water scenario that correlates with the idea that Sora (or whoever the protagonist is really) is experiencing something that he would never experience on his home world, or any other world for that matter, and more importantly one that defies normal standards and presents the player with a sense of mysticism and fairy tale-esque spectacle, which can qualify for pretty much any world that's already been used in Kingdom Hearts because they all follow this standard. Every world is set in fantasy, and even if its  based in the real world, it's counteracted with enough fantasy (such as a supernatural aid or by being set in a different time period with a unique culture) to make it work all the same.

 

That's why I would be absolutely appalled if Zootopia or something similar to that would be used as a world because it misses the point entirely. There's no mysticism or spectacle in a property like that. Yeah, everybody's a talking animal but that idea in general isn't all that great on its own for one thing, and even then, it's still too close to real life. Anything too close to real life in general gets an automatic "NO" from me, but I'm sure I've made that obvious by this point.

 

Now, I know what you're thinking: does that mean I'm against Big Hero 6 too? Well, no actually, I'm not. I do have my worries as it is still very close to real life and there could be ways of taking that too far in terms of how it's presented but as long as its done gracefully, I won't have a problem with it.

 

Hopefully I've gotten the idea across because I really didn't want to write blocks of text when I can just try to make things easier to digest.

 

I agree with most of what you said.....riiiiiight up until you presented your "no's" and doubts for Zootopia and Big Hero 6. Yes, on premise alone, those two movies act and almost look like contemporary real life. BUT, you said that there has to be a sense of mysticism about the whole thing, and I would argue that both movies are very prevalent in that. Ignore the fact that the basic plot of Zootopia is "humans are replaced with evolved animals, their society is a parody of ours, and racism is still a thing) and what are you left with to examine apart from the creative use of the characters? The world that they made up for the movie, which as is to be expected from Disney films IS FREAKING AWESOME! They could have been completely boring and just made it a regular looking city exactly like ours with maybe a few clever billboards and street names here and there, but no, they went all out, they made it a multi-biome mega-metropolis! Each area is a different climate with different features. The jungle area with it's tall verticality, rain forest features, and elevated freeways. The desert area with it's more eastern style influences, the arctic section, even the central metropolis area still has rather creative and unique architecture to make it look "animal-y". As a world itself, it sounds like it would be a HUGE FUN PLAYGROUND to just run, jump, and swing all around in epic fashion. The only flaw I could see with this is that the nature of the conflict of the plot might feel a bit incompatible with the Heartless. I mean, we've already got enough to deal with with just animals turning on and accusing each other, what point is there in having the Heartless cause mass hysteria? I mean, that's not to say that if they wanted to do it they couldn't figure out a good scenario (sounds like they're really going for the post-movie formula so far...), but as far as adapting the movie's plot is concerned, that may be the only real hurdle I can think of that might make this world a bit of a tricky choice.

 

 

As far as Big Hero 6 is concerned, that should have no reason for worry whatsoever. Yes it's yet another familiar modern urban setting, but the main difference is that it's a) two famous cities fused into one, b) in the future with plenty of futury things everywhere because future, and q) it's ANIMATED!! This is quite possibly the only Marvel movie that could ever certainly work within the realm of Kingdom Hearts based on those points alone, not to mention the fact that there's enough superheroing going on to make a plot with the Heartless feel natural enough to not be too intrusive. So it's got a fun and unique looking structure with enough variety to play around with and be entertained for hours, it's got a compatible story that doesn't even interrupt the events of the movie, all the characters are interesting and fun enough to have some great interaction scenes with Sora and the gang. Seems like everything is already in place for a good world. With all this in mind, I don't see much of a point in getting hung up over how little it kind of resembles modern day San Francisco. I don't think anyone was complaining about how in Deep Jungle it looked like they were actually in Africa, though likely cause it was heavily stylized, or how it was to be in Port Royal with areas based off of parts of the Caribbean (well okay people complained about having Sora next to realistic looking models, but I never saw a problem with that personally). Most of that stuff was either heavily stylized or had enough mysticism or adventure going on to really make it feel both Disneyish and Kingdom Heartsy enough to fit right in. So since San Fransokyo has enough of both going on, as well as a really stylized animated look, I see no real reason to be concerned with that one.

 

I guess maybe I have looser rules when it comes to this stuff, but I will say that a lot of what you said are good standards to go by. Which is why a majority of films I keep seeing newer fans post like National Treasure and stuff would not make great choices in my opinion, sometimes there's just not enough fantasmic things going on with them, their settings are just too contemporary (literally just either 2005, 2008, 2012, or last Tuesday ), most of them are just globetrotting, and either the character setups just aren't as enticing or the plot just doesn't have enough to offer to make something like having the Heartless interfere with the conflict actually have any place. As much as I like to give anything a fair chance, unless the teams say otherwise, there need to be clear established guidelines that don't necessarily dictate what worlds should be in KH, but at the very least explore why all the previous worlds worked, what they shared in common that made them good choices, and why those traits should be considered when looking at other potential movies to make into worlds.

Edited April 15, 2016 by Hero of Light XIV

[lehahiah81 60]

I agree with most of what you said.....riiiiiight up until you presented your "no's" and doubts for Zootopia and Big Hero 6. Yes, on premise alone, those two movies act and almost look like contemporary real life. BUT, you said that there has to be a sense of mysticism about the whole thing, and I would argue that both movies are very prevalent in that. Ignore the fact that the basic plot of Zootopia is "humans are replaced with evolved animals, their society is a parody of ours, and racism is still a thing) and what are you left with to examine apart from the creative use of the characters? The world that they made up for the movie, which as is to be expected from Disney films IS FREAKING AWESOME! They could have been completely boring and just made it a regular looking city exactly like ours with maybe a few clever billboards and street names here and there, but no, they went all out, they made it a multi-biome mega-metropolis! Each area is a different climate with different features. The jungle area with it's tall verticality, rain forest features, and elevated freeways. The desert area with it's more eastern style influences, the arctic section, even the central metropolis area still has rather creative and unique architecture to make it look "animal-y". As a world itself, it sounds like it would be a HUGE FUN PLAYGROUND to just run, jump, and swing all around in epic fashion. The only flaw I could see with this is that the nature of the conflict of the plot might feel a bit incompatible with the Heartless. I mean, we've already got enough to deal with with just animals turning on and accusing each other, what point is there in having the Heartless cause mass hysteria? I mean, that's not to say that if they wanted to do it they couldn't figure out a good scenario (sounds like they're really going for the post-movie formula so far...), but as far as adapting the movie's plot is concerned, that may be the only real hurdle I can think of that might make this world a bit of a tricky choice.

 

As far as Big Hero 6 is concerned, that should have no reason for worry whatsoever. Yes it's yet another familiar modern urban setting, but the main difference is that it's a) two famous cities fused into one, b) in the future with plenty of futury things everywhere because future, and q) it's ANIMATED!! This is quite possibly the only Marvel movie that could ever certainly work within the realm of Kingdom Hearts based on those points alone, not to mention the fact that there's enough superheroing going on to make a plot with the Heartless feel natural enough to not be too intrusive. So it's got a fun and unique looking structure with enough variety to play around with and be entertained for hours, it's got a compatible story that doesn't even interrupt the events of the movie, all the characters are interesting and fun enough to have some great interaction scenes with Sora and the gang. Seems like everything is already in place for a good world. With all this in mind, I don't see much of a point in getting hung up over how little it kind of resembles modern day San Francisco. I don't think anyone was complaining about how in Deep Jungle it looked like they were actually in Africa, though likely cause it was heavily stylized, or how it was to be in Port Royal with areas based off of parts of the Caribbean (well okay people complained about having Sora next to realistic looking models, but I never saw a problem with that personally). Most of that stuff was either heavily stylized or had enough mysticism or adventure going on to really make it feel both Disneyish and Kingdom Heartsy enough to fit right in. So since San Fransokyo has enough of both going on, as well as a really stylized animated look, I see no real reason to be concerned with that one.

 

I guess maybe I have looser rules when it comes to this stuff, but I will say that a lot of what you said are good standards to go by. Which is why a majority of films I keep seeing newer fans post like National Treasure and stuff would not make great choices in my opinion, sometimes there's just not enough fantasmic things going on with them, their settings are just too contemporary (literally just either 2005, 2008, 2012, or last Tuesday ), most of them are just globetrotting, and either the character setups just aren't as enticing or the plot just doesn't have enough to offer to make something like having the Heartless interfere with the conflict actually have any place. As much as I like to give anything a fair chance, unless the teams say otherwise, there need to be clear established guidelines that don't necessarily dictate what worlds should be in KH, but at the very least explore why all the previous worlds worked, what they shared in common that made them good choices, and why those traits should be considered when looking at other potential movies to make into worlds.

I think you might of quoted the wrong comment, because I didn't go into that much detail or go on about doubts for zootopia just things close to reality. I don't really have any problems against Zootopia or BH6 because they still have enough of a fantasy element to them and room to build a plot around that could work into the overall story, but I've seen people recommend things that are way too close to  reality like recess, and another problem is people recommending things without watching the things they choose. 

[Dr. Gauntlet 5]

I think you might of quoted the wrong comment, because I didn't go into that much detail or go on about doubts for zootopia just things close to reality. I don't really have any problems against Zootopia or BH6 because they still have enough of a fantasy element to them and room to build a plot around that could work into the overall story, but I've seen people recommend things that are way too close to  reality like recess, and another problem is people recommending things without watching the things they choose. 

Alright. Recess would actually work. AT least the Recess movie since it had aliens that tried to sabotage the school. I'd say that'd work.

[lehahiah81 60]

Alright. Recess would actually work. AT least the Recess movie since it had aliens that tried to sabotage the school. I'd say that'd work.

Actually the recess movie was about the schools old principal trying to get rid of summer vacation to increase test grades. A school by itself is a rather boring setting in my opinion, and just putting a tractor beam there won't do anything to help it. 

[Dr. Gauntlet 5]

Actually the recess movie was about the schools old principal trying to get rid of summer vacation to increase test grades. A school by itself is a rather boring setting in my opinion, and just putting a tractor beam there won't do anything to help it. 

My memory was a little off. And yea it would be a boring setting in comparison to most of the other world ideas.

[Firaga 5,947]

Hero, your blocks of test need to staph.

 

Look, Zootoopia just does not have any mysticism to it, alright? It's literally just animals in the guise of humans dealing with otherwise human issues. There's nothing that has the splendor of Disney's other fairy tale-esque stories.

 

Big Hero 6 I only have worries about because I just don't want it to go over the limit. I know that sounds weird, but for reference, look at Port Royal. Yeah, people still complain about the aesthetics but in terms of story, it managed to fit well into the universe while still incorporating the whole pirate schtick. If BH6 can do the same, then again, I have no qualms.