Sora's being of darkness

[ExcisionGaming 2]

hey guys if xehanort's keyblade has the ability to extract the darkness out of someones heart and make it into its own ability what if he does it to sora and makes them clash to create the chi-blade. and yes i know that he has his plans of the 13 different versions of himself but what if its his true plan the whole time or maybe a backup plan B- by the way this is my first thread sorry if i dont know what im doing

and vanitas looks like sora but with black hair and yellow eyes becouse of ventus and sora connection so what if sora being of pure darkness looks like ventus but with black hair and yellow eyes

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

It has been confirmed in game and also by Nomura that there is only one way to form the Xblade- 13 darkness and 7 light. The original X-blade was shattered into 20 pieces not 2. 1 Light vs 1 Darkness was proven false and incomplete stated by MX himself too. It's also the reason we did not see the real KH in BBS - it was incomplete.

[ExcisionGaming 2]

It has been confirmed in game and also by Nomura that there is only one way to form the Xblade- 13 darkness and 7 light. The original X-blade was shattered into 20 pieces not 2. 1 Light vs 1 Darkness was proven false and incomplete stated by MX himself too. It's also the reason we did not see the real KH in BBS - it was incomplete.

the only reason the x-blade wasnt finished in bbs is becouse ventus and vanitas never fully merged the only requirments for the x-blade to form is pure light and pure darkness clash but thats not the piont of this post i just wanted to throw out an idea of a new caracther being created an an instant from sora what would he look like what would he do??

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

the only reason the x-blade wasnt finished in bbs is becouse ventus and vanitas never fully merged the only requirments for the x-blade to form is pure light and pure darkness clash but thats not the piont of this post i just wanted to throw out an idea of a new caracther being created an an instant from sora what would he look like what would he do??

Actually no: in BBS that was the reason. DDD retconned this so nope we go with the most recent canon material in which it's stated in game why it was incomplete and Nomura has also confirmed this. It is said there is only one way and that's the 13 and 7. That's the "original" Xblade prophecy involving the 20 pieces the xblade shattered into. Watch this again. MX states the true way:

 

 

 

 

 

As for your idea -it would just be like having another Vanitas - and Vanitas imho was a huge fail of a villain- we don't need a knock off. It's bad enough we can expect Vanitas back in KH3.

[ExcisionGaming 2]

Actually no: in BBS that was the reason. DDD retconned this so nope we go with the most recent canon material in which it's stated in game why it was incomplete and Nomura has also confirmed this. It is said there is only one way and that's the 13 and 7. That's the "original" Xblade prophecy involving the 20 pieces the xblade shattered into. Watch this again. MX states the true way:

 

 

 

 

 

As for your idea -it would just be like having another Vanitas - and Vanitas imho was a huge fail of a villain- we don't need a knock off. It's bad enough we can expect Vanitas back in KH3.

ok well iether way i was thinking this was possibly the way that ventus was awakened but i guess im wrong just thought it was something to think about here my video on it 

 

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

ok well iether way i was thinking this was possibly the way that ventus was awakened but i guess im wrong just thought it was something to think about here my video on it 

 

 

Nothing wrong with making theories and having fun. Welcome to the site

[ExcisionGaming 2]

thnx

[Hero of Light XIV 2,381]

Nah, for one thing the actual true way of making the X-Blade is with the 7 Lights and 13 Darknesses, the whole 1 Pure Light and 1 Pure Darkness thing was just Xehanort getting desperate, even he admits that it wasn't the correct way to create the blade. If Ventus and Vanitas did fully fuse it would create A X-Blade, but only in the same sense that other Keyblades were made from people. The actual X-Blade is a counterpart of the true Kingdom Hearts, and if there can be "false" Kingdom Hearts like we've seen in previous games, then there can also be "false" X-Blades. If anything the only method we are going to see is the one that Xehanort hyped up in DDD, which in my opinion will literally be 20% cooler than the BBS method.

 

As for the whole "neo-Vanitas" from Sora thing, I think that's going to have to be another big NO from me. I think we've already got enough Soras running around, it would be pointless to try and introduce yet another version of him when this storyline is supposed to be coming to a close. We already have a "dark Sora" in Vanitas, so if anything I'd rather just see Sora interact with Vanitas instead of yet another shady doppleganger.

 

Actually no: in BBS that was the reason. DDD retconned this so nope we go with the most recent canon material in which it's stated in game why it was incomplete and Nomura has also confirmed this. It is said there is only one way and that's the 13 and 7. That's the "original" Xblade prophecy involving the 20 pieces the xblade shattered into. Watch this again. MX states the true way:

 

 

 

 

 

As for your idea -it would just be like having another Vanitas - and Vanitas imho was a huge fail of a villain- we don't need a knock off. It's bad enough we can expect Vanitas back in KH3.

 

I'm actually going to give Vanitas some credit, I thought he was a pretty interesting villain. Truthfully I wouldn't want a knock-off Vanitas either, but I don't see it as a bad thing to expect him to return in KH3, if anything that thought gets me even more hyped. I guess you're going to have your tastes, but as for me I'm totally in favor of the guy returning, things will definitely get a lot more interesting with Vanitas around.

[MasterLorX 43]

actually I believe a new 1light vs. 1darkness could be an interesting plan B for xehanort, I know this would only create a FALSE X-blade and a FALSE KH but think about this:

 

xehanort, ansem and xemnas tried to create many KH in previous games, they knew that those were FALSE or ARTIFICIAL KH but still wanted to create them, so this make me think their individual plans were to become powerful beings with the power of these KH and then to try accomplishing the REAL xehanort plan to create the ORIGINAL X-blade with the advantages of this new power, otherwise BBS, KH1 and KH2 would make no sense.

 

so this means if things go wrong for xehanort in KH3 it is possible he could try to create a FALSE KH just to become more powerful so he can retry to accomplish his true plan, just as he, ansem and xemnas tried to do in the past

Edited March 3, 2016 by MasterLorX

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Nah, for one thing the actual true way of making the X-Blade is with the 7 Lights and 13 Darknesses, the whole 1 Pure Light and 1 Pure Darkness thing was just Xehanort getting desperate, even he admits that it wasn't the correct way to create the blade. If Ventus and Vanitas did fully fuse it would create A X-Blade, but only in the same sense that other Keyblades were made from people. The actual X-Blade is a counterpart of the true Kingdom Hearts, and if there can be "false" Kingdom Hearts like we've seen in previous games, then there can also be "false" X-Blades. If anything the only method we are going to see is the one that Xehanort hyped up in DDD, which in my opinion will literally be 20% cooler than the BBS method.As for the whole "neo-Vanitas" from Sora thing, I think that's going to have to be another big NO from me. I think we've already got enough Soras running around, it would be pointless to try and introduce yet another version of him when this storyline is supposed to be coming to a close. We already have a "dark Sora" in Vanitas, so if anything I'd rather just see Sora interact with Vanitas instead of yet another shady doppleganger.I'm actually going to give Vanitas some credit, I thought he was a pretty interesting villain. Truthfully I wouldn't want a knock-off Vanitas either, but I don't see it as a bad thing to expect him to return in KH3, if anything that thought gets me even more hyped. I guess you're going to have your tastes, but as for me I'm totally in favor of the guy returning, things will definitely get a lot more interesting with Vanitas around.

well you can think that all you want but I am still less than impressed with the character myself lol

actually I believe a new 1light vs. 1darkness could be an interesting plan B for xehanort, I know this would only create a FALSE X-blade and a FALSE KH but think about this:xehanort, ansem and xemnas tried to create many KH in previous games, they knew that those were FALSE or ARTIFICIAL KH but still wanted to create them, so this make me think their individual plans were to become powerful beings with the power of these KH and then to try accomplishing the REAL xehanort plan to create the ORIGINAL X-blade with the advantages of this new power, otherwise BBS, KH1 and KH2 would make no sense.so this means if things go wrong for xehanort in KH3 it is possible he could try to create a FALSE KH just to become more powerful so he can retry to accomplish his true plan, just as he, ansem and xemnas tried to do in the past

Well if you watched that video I posted it was that all his incarnations attempted things in haste and to gather what was eventually needed to achieve said ingredients.. All thanks to retcons lol

[Headphone Jack 1,147]

it's a shame they dropped the 1 light vs. 1 darkness concept. it's much more focused and intense when it's a one on one, with each person essentially being the embodiment of what their side stands for. 

 

but nope.

[MasterLorX 43]

Well if you watched that video I posted it was that all his incarnations attempted things in haste and to gather what was eventually needed to achieve said ingredients.. All thanks to retcons lol

actually he only said HE acted rashly in BBS, what ansem and xemnas did was decided, at this point since xehanort is a rational man I find it obvious they created artificial KH just as a intermediate step to accomplish his true goal faster and easierplus ansem and xemnas were around for like 10 years so I don't think we can say they acted rashly, their plans to create artificial KH were already decided

[ExcisionGaming 2]

im happy this thread got where it is  :biggrin:

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

actually he only said HE acted rashly in BBS, what ansem and xemnas did was decided, at this point since xehanort is a rational man I find it obvious they created artificial KH just as a intermediate step to accomplish his true goal faster and easierplus ansem and xemnas were around for like 10 years so I don't think we can say they acted rashly, their plans to create artificial KH were already decided

 

I think you missed what I was saying - part was haste ( MX's) and part was gathering said ingredients for said plan. All his incarnations are MX just to be clear. So yes even those artificial KH could be useful.  I was just pointing out that Nomura had to have some reasoning to explain away retcons so those other games wouldn't be pointless. MX always has some BS reasoning or plan B for his failed plans.

[MasterLorX 43]

I think you missed what I was saying - part was haste ( MX's) and part was gathering said ingredients for said plan. All his incarnations are MX just to be clear. So yes even those artificial KH could be useful.  I was just pointing out that Nomura had to have some reasoning to explain away retcons so those other games wouldn't be pointless. MX always has some BS reasoning or plan B for his failed plans.

yes I know Nomura wanted to explain retcons but we can't say KH1 and KH2 were just hasty attempts to obtain KH as BBS, ansem plan was to gather the 7 PoH, xemnas plan was to gather 13 vessels, for them to achieve their individual plans it wasn't strictly necessary to create a false KH but it sure would have helped, they knew they weren't going to create the original KH and that's why they didn't acted rashly

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

yes I know Nomura wanted to explain retcons but we can't say KH1 and KH2 were just hasty attempts to obtain KH as BBS, ansem plan was to gather the 7 PoH, xemnas plan was to gather 13 vessels, for them to achieve their individual plans it wasn't strictly necessary to create a false KH but it sure would have helped, they knew they weren't going to create the original KH and that's why they didn't acted rashly

 

MX acted rashly in BBS as he explained.I don't know how many different ways to say this. All the other incarnations attempted their versions of artificial KH as if they were to be successful subsitutes to achieve the KH and figured at the very least they were still following the plan if it didn't. DDD made it clear this would not have worked when during these games it would be presented that it would. Why? It had to explain away retcons with continuity. No matter what you say to excuse this - it's fact. Nomura admitted he wrote all this as he went.

[MasterLorX 43]

All the other incarnations attempted their versions of artificial KH as if they were to be successful subsitutes to achieve the KH and figured at the very least they were still following the plan if it didn't

ok so this is the part we don't agree, you say they thought those artificial KH would have been perfect substitutes for the original KH, instead I'm trying to say they already knew they were just artificial copiesthey had 10 years, do you really think they only realised at the very end their artificial KH weren't going to work for xehanort's (still unknown) plan?they have probably always known it Edited March 3, 2016 by MasterLorX

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

ok so this is the part we don't agree, you say they thought those artificial KH would have been perfect substitutes for the original KH, instead I'm trying to say they already knew they were just artificial copiesthey had 10 years, do you really think they only realised at the very end their artificial KH weren't going to work for xehanort's (still unknown) plan?

 

Once again at the time the games were made these incarnations definitely thought it would work to use those artificial versions. Why else do you think they were so pissed off and upset Sora (and also Riku) ruined it for them both times? It really wouldn't have mattered if it were like you said and they were merely just gathering "ingredients." Only DDD retcons changed this.

[MasterLorX 43]

Once again at the time the games were made these incarnations definitely thought it would work to use those artificial versions. Why else do you think they were so pissed off and upset Sora (and also Riku) ruined it for them both times? It really wouldn't have mattered if it were like you said and they were merely just gathering "ingredients." Only DDD retcons changed this.

ok I get your point, honestly I still prefer my version but I have to agree your theory is at least possiblejust two more questions:-when do you think xehanort realised the KH he previously summoned/created were not useful for his plan?-I understand Nomura wrote 3D later, but are we 100% sure the 13 vs 7 stuff was not written earlier? I find it strange Nomura just invented this for KH3D and KH3 Edited March 3, 2016 by MasterLorX

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

ok I get your point, honestly I still prefer my version but I have to agree your theory is at least possible

just two more questions:

-when do you think xehanort realised the previous KH he previously summoned/created were not useful for his plan?

-I understand Nomura wrote 3D later, but are we 100% sure the 13 vs 7 stuff was not written since the beginning? I find it strange Nomura just invented this for KH3D and KH3

 

  Xehanort took risks- he fabricated three diff versions and since it had not be done yet who is to say it wouldn't work? He was getting old and he was trying plan after plan. Even his current plan is fabricating the ingredients since hes manufacturing his darknesses and they are not the original 13 darkness pieces. The light pieces are the 7 PoH but even still he says he can subsitute the 7 guardians of light and either way it will work. That's his biggest problem- he's always got a plan A, B, C bc he's just so desperate to achieve his goal. Or that's how DDD presents it.

 

And yes I'm certain he wrote this as he went he's admitted this SEVERAL times. It's not a secret. He was still conceiving DDD's story when it went into production. You can think what I'm saying is a 'theory' and just "possible" but the facts of the situation back up what I'm saying.

 

• When the first KINGDOM HEARTS was released, we did not know that the series would continue over the years to reach its tenth birthday. The story chronicles the Seeker of Darkness has it developed progressively games, or did you have in mind an idea of the overall story of this saga from the beginning?

Nomura : When I created the first KINGDOM HEARTS, I did not have a clear vision of the history of the Seeker of Darkness, but I was already thinking of the KINGDOM HEARTS II and Chain of Memories. I knew at that time that there were two additional games after the first KINGDOM HEARTS. Later, when I finished KINGDOM HEARTS Chain of Memories, I had other plans: Birth by Sleep, 358/2 Days and coded. This is kind of what happened in the history of the series: I did not have a clear idea of the whole story from the beginning, but it is built over time.

• Speaking of the previous titles, about when do you start thinking of the “next title”?

It’s a gradual process. When Kingdom Hearts was in production, I was considering ideas for Kingdom Hearts II and Chain of Memories. And when those two were in production, I was thinking of ideas for the next three, 358/2 Days, Coded, and Birth by Sleep.

 

• Were you thinking of KH3D when those 3 titles were in production?

KH3D was put together relatively quickly, I was still concepting the story when I brought it to the table.

[MasterLorX 43]

Xehanort took risks- he fabricated three diff versions and since it had not be done yet who is to say it wouldn't work? He was getting old and he was trying plan after plan. Even his current plan is fabricating the ingredients since hes manufacturing his darknesses and they are not the original 13 darkness pieces. The light pieces are the 7 PoH but even still he says he can subsitute the 7 guardians of light and either way it will work. That's his biggest problem- he's always got a plan A, B, C bc he's just so desperate to achieve his goal. Or that's how DDD presents it.

 

And yes I'm certain he wrote this as he went he's admitted this SEVERAL times. It's not a secret. He was still conceiving DDD's story when it went into production. You can think what I'm saying is a 'theory' and just "possible" but the facts of the situation back up what I'm saying.

 

[*]When the first KINGDOM HEARTS was released, we did not know that the series would continue over the years to reach its tenth birthday. The story chronicles the Seeker of Darkness has it developed progressively games, or did you have in mind an idea of the overall story of this saga from the beginning?

Nomura : When I created the first KINGDOM HEARTS, I did not have a clear vision of the history of the Seeker of Darkness, but I was already thinking of the KINGDOM HEARTS II and Chain of Memories. I knew at that time that there were two additional games after the first KINGDOM HEARTS. Later, when I finished KINGDOM HEARTS Chain of Memories, I had other plans: Birth by Sleep, 358/2 Days and coded. This is kind of what happened in the history of the series: I did not have a clear idea of the whole story from the beginning, but it is built over time.

[*]Speaking of the previous titles, about when do you start thinking of the “next title”?

It’s a gradual process. When Kingdom Hearts was in production, I was considering ideas for Kingdom Hearts II and Chain of Memories. And when those two were in production, I was thinking of ideas for the next three, 358/2 Days, Coded, and Birth by Sleep.

 

[*]Were you thinking of KH3D when those 3 titles were in production?

KH3D was put together relatively quickly, I was still concepting the story when I brought it to the table.

ok I admit this reinforces your theory but still no one EXPLICITLY said ansem and xemnas though those KH would work as substitutes or that xehanort only understood the true way to achieve his goals just before KH3D

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

ok I admit this reinforces your theory but still no one EXPLICITLY said ansem and xemnas though those KH would work as substitutes or that xehanort only understood the true way to achieve his goals just before KH3D

 

Welp my proof of where i'm going with this is stronger than your proof- which so far is nothing. Believe what you want though.  As for DDD he said he always knew the correct way but was hasty and tried anyways. Why? Desperation and running out of time ( getting old)

[MasterLorX 43]

Welp my proof of where i'm going with this is stronger than your proof- which so far is nothing. Believe what you want though.  As for DDD he said he always knew the correct way but was hasty and tried anyways. Why? Desperation and running out of time ( getting old)

this perfectly explains BBS but since he fused with terra he had a lot of time, so initially he didn't have to be quick and you said it too he always knew the correct way so this means KH1 and KH2 were not hasty attemptsbtw it's difficult to be objective when defending our own ideas , someone else should read all this stuff and say what is more plausible for him

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

this perfectly explains BBS but since he fused with terra he had a lot of time, so initially he didn't have to be quick and you said it too he always knew the correct way so this means KH1 and KH2 were not hasty attempts

 

btw it's difficult to be objective when defending our own ideas , someone else should read all this stuff and say what is more plausible for him

 

The fact that he knew the correct way but tried anyways making artificial ones which he had a history of doing bc of BBS only backs up what i am saying- just like him manufacturing the 13 darknesses in the present  backs up what i'm saying. He's still willing to manufacture the ingredients by manufacturing 13 darknesses and using either the GoL or the real light pieces the PoH. You have provided nothing to prove yourself facts or interviews and nothing to prove me wrong as well. Anyone can read this it's a public forum.

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

this perfectly explains BBS but since he fused with terra he had a lot of time, so initially he didn't have to be quick and you said it too he always knew the correct way so this means KH1 and KH2 were not hasty attemptsbtw it's difficult to be objective when defending our own ideas , someone else should read all this stuff and say what is more plausible for him

Dude she had you awhile ago it's almost embarassing. Sorry lol