Why NPCs would never work in Kingdom Hearts

[DaxovanHearts 452]

So I've noticed that a lot of people have been clamoring over the absence of NPCs in the Kingdom Hearts series, and saying that Kingdom Hearts III needs NPCs. Why isn't this a good idea?

 

It'll ruin the game.

 

On paper it looks like a good idea, but in my mind there are two reasons as to why NPCs would not work. First and foremost, placing NPCs in the Disney based worlds would be awkward. What would they do, just make a bunch of "Little Mermaid" looking characters that didn't even exist in the real film? Aladdin? If people are saying that it would be different for Twilight Town, etc., here's the thing: why would one world be so populated and the rest just.... Empty?

 

Second of all, and probably the most important part of this topic, is that what would these tons of NPCs do at the sight of heartless and nobodies? Run in a frenzy every five seconds when monsters show up? How would the battle system work if you're just jumping over hundreds of people? Even one To five NPCs just running in a circle like crazy every time a Shadow appeared would just be stupid. Would they just disappear in thin air and the scene would transition into a battle arena? That's dumb. Kingdom Hearts hasn't done that except for Chain of Memories.

 

Also, I thought of a third thing. NPCs roaming around are supposed to designate a safe area. Like when Donald and Goofy just mindlessly roam around and their HP/MP bars just disappear in certain rooms. It means there are no heartless there. You're good for now.

 

Thoughts?

Edited December 6, 2015 by DaxovanHearts

[Soul_Seeker 753]

So I've noticed that a lot of people have been clamoring over the absence of NPCs in the Kingdom Hearts series, and saying that Kingdom Hearts III needs NPCs. Why isn't this a good idea?It'll ruin the game.On paper it looks like a good idea, but in my mind there are two reasons as to why NPCs would not work. First and foremost, placing NPCs in the Disney based worlds would be awkward. What would they do, just make a bunch of "Little Mermaid" looking characters that didn't even exist in the real film? Aladdin? If people are saying that it would be different for Twilight Town, etc., here's the thing: why would one world be so populated and the rest just.... Empty?Second of all, and probably the most important part of this topic, is that what would these tons of NPCs do at the sight of heartless and nobodies? Run in a frenzy every five seconds when monsters show up? How would the battle system work if you're just jumping over hundreds of people? Even one To five NPCs just running in a circle like crazy every time a Shadow appeared would just be stupid. Would they just disappear in thin air and the scene would transition into a battle arena? That's dumb. Kingdom Hearts hasn't done that except for Chain of Memories.Also, I thought of a third thing. NPCs roaming around are supposed to designate a safe area. Like when Donald and Goofy just mindlessly roam around and their HP/MP bars just disappear in certain rooms. It means there are no heartless there. You're good for now.Thoughts?

I mean, the idea of more NPCs doesn't necessarily mean in a battle zone. Maybe just in a "world hub" or "safe area" of some sort.

I agree that in a battle zone, NPCs really wouldn't have much purpose unless they reacted accordingly. I guess if they were to, for whatever reason, put them in battle zones, they could make the NPCs unable to be interacted with unless all of the enemies are cleared. Maybe they could give a little cowering animation to NPCs for added effect.

 

Still, though, I see where you're coming from. Maybe just leave the NPCs out of battle zones.

[Nero Kunivas 3,046]

It's quite simple:

 

Either leave them out of Battle Zones entirely.

 

Or:

 

Have them react accordingly.

 

We're not asking for Flash Mob levels of NPC's, just enough to give the worlds more life, rather than the barren wastelands they have been made to feel like. And while there are worlds in KH that are uninhabited, most are bustling towns or highly populated zones anyway, so the lack of people is suspect and immersion breaking.

 

And let's not forget Aladdin's comment about the people of Agrabah while the camera shows what looks like Agrabah after the Apocalypse.

Edited December 6, 2015 by SuperiorKunivas

[Dave 5,715]

So I've noticed that a lot of people have been clamoring over the absence of NPCs in the Kingdom Hearts series, and saying that Kingdom Hearts III needs NPCs. Why isn't this a good idea?

 

It'll ruin the game.

 

On paper it looks like a good idea, but in my mind there are two reasons as to why NPCs would not work. First and foremost, placing NPCs in the Disney based worlds would be awkward. What would they do, just make a bunch of "Little Mermaid" looking characters that didn't even exist in the real film? Aladdin? If people are saying that it would be different for Twilight Town, etc., here's the thing: why would one world be so populated and the rest just.... Empty?

 

 

Actually, the films have a lot of people which might be considered NPCs. A ton of mermaids show up for the concert recital at the start of the Little Mermaid, and the market place in Aladdin is swarming with people. If they wanted to, I'm sure they could recreate a few stock characters to wander about the worlds, if they put the time and effort in.

 

 

 

Second of all, and probably the most important part of this topic, is that what would these tons of NPCs do at the sight of heartless and nobodies? Run in a frenzy every five seconds when monsters show up? How would the battle system work if you're just jumping over hundreds of people? Even one To five NPCs just running in a circle like crazy every time a Shadow appeared would just be stupid. Would they just disappear in thin air and the scene would transition into a battle arena? That's dumb. Kingdom Hearts hasn't done that except for Chain of Memories.

 

Given the way that the games are designed, there are distinct stages where you are safe, and places where you do battle. Presumably, the NPCs would be in the places where fighting isn't going to take place.

 

 

 

Also, I thought of a third thing. NPCs roaming around are supposed to designate a safe area. Like when Donald and Goofy just mindlessly roam around and their HP/MP bars just disappear in certain rooms. It means there are no heartless there. You're good for now.

 

...Um, you kind of just answered the second problem. Unless your saying that this shouldn't be the case? I guess signalling that there are no Heartless around might cut the tension, but again, that's how all of the games have been produced thus far, so it's not like they'd be reinventing the wheel on this one.

[Forever 3,550]

What's wrong with making the NCPs act afraid? They can cower a little, then resume what they were doing once the fighting is over, no worries. Most of the time I don't mind the lack of them, but in places like Castle of Dreams, it was awkward seeing only like- 5 people present when it was supposed to be a BALL. In KH3, we're supposed to be getting a full map of San Fransokyo , and if there isn't at least a little life, it will be bizarre, to say the least. I know Keyblade wielders are supposed to be kind of a hush, hush, thing, but....come on, you can't tell me that NO one ever looks out of their apartment window, or travels along the streets, without seeing at least one teenager with a giant Key and weird clothes run past them.

[TheKingdomkid 1,194]

I mean KH2 had NPC's in Twilight Town and Radiant Garden, they where just in areas that didn't see any combat whatsoever so I don't see anything bad with adding one or two of those kinds of areas to all the worlds where they could actually have shops and such

[Headphone Jack 1,147]

i think it's all about the implementation. how about some NPC's get thrown into the worlds after Sora and co. have sealed the keyhole to show that the world is now safer. Then certain areas can be designated as safe zones and areas other than those can have random encounters. 

or just skip that first bit and have the safe zones in the worlds all along. you know the rooms with save points? Maybe expand those a bit and fill them with a couple of NPCs. Bam. there you go. NPCs could work in KH as long as they're implemented in the right way. 

[DaxovanHearts 452]

Actually, the films have a lot of people which might be considered NPCs. A ton of mermaids show up for the concert recital at the start of the Little Mermaid, and the market place in Aladdin is swarming with people. If they wanted to, I'm sure they could recreate a few stock characters to wander about the worlds, if they put the time and effort in.

 

 

Given the way that the games are designed, there are distinct stages where you are safe, and places where you do battle. Presumably, the NPCs would be in the places where fighting isn't going to take place.

 

 

...Um, you kind of just answered the second problem. Unless your saying that this shouldn't be the case? I guess signalling that there are no Heartless around might cut the tension, but again, that's how all of the games have been produced thus far, so it's not like they'd be reinventing the wheel on this one.

99% of the world map is a battle zone. The only place where Monsters don't show up in the map of Twilight Town is The Usual Spot and Sandlot. The Market Street, Tram Commons, Old Woods, Train Station, etc. All are technically battle zones. So why would NPCs only be in the Sandlot but not in the Market Street? See what I mean? I do like the idea of them cowering like someone else stated, but I'm just afraid they'd get in the way. 

i think it's all about the implementation. how about some NPC's get thrown into the worlds after Sora and co. have sealed the keyhole to show that the world is now safer. Then certain areas can be designated as safe zones and areas other than those can have random encounters. 

or just skip that first bit and have the safe zones in the worlds all along. you know the rooms with save points? Maybe expand those a bit and fill them with a couple of NPCs. Bam. there you go. NPCs could work in KH as long as they're implemented in the right way. 

Maybe NPCs only in the cutscenes? 

[NoWay 63]

Or NPCs who turn into Heartless

[Headphone Jack 1,147]

Maybe NPCs only in the cutscenes? 

hell i'd settle for that. especially when it comes to those awkward cutscenes where a crowd is supposed to be present and yet no one is around.

[Rob 5,571]

Rob could only see NPC's like in KH2 and BBS. Never during combat situation. Sure, they could be in that situation and just disappear while running away. haha

[IwasBornAsVentus 396]

I disagree with that it ruins the game but that's my opinion. Without npc's the worlds feels very empty and Im truly tired of only seeing heartless in different worlds. KH2 was the closest so far where npc's were making the world feel more alive along with KH1. I mean I have enjoyed playing KH games throughout the stories of the worlds but they are so empty and some of them even feels unfinished. Im probably the only one that wanted npc's around in the DDD worlds I thought it was a missed opportunity to not add the Pegasus, Centaurs and other characters that appeared in Fantasia. I have strong hopes that KH3 will move into a new direction where the worlds will be more developed to have life running around in the big areas. I would only like the game more if npc's helps out in battles if the battles are going to be challenging I definitely wouldn't mind if the rest of the BH6 team helps out in a fight.

Edited December 6, 2015 by IwasBornAsVentus

[Master Keeper 687]

I think it would work out like any other game.

Disney characters that never existed is the point of having more awesomeness in the game, we can't deny that a lot of places were not originally from a movie scene either, the idea that Square Enix is doing with Disney worlds is creating the beautiful scenes that we have saw in the movie and creating more fitting places that would give the person the feeling of both "movie" and a "game". 
Now since Square Enix managed to create places related to Disney from their own imagination, wouldn't they be able to create NCPs that would fit the worlds too? God even Disney that is not that famous of its video gaming angle managed to create beautiful NCPs in Epic Mickey and we have seen few NCPs in both KHI and KHII from Atlaltica, Agrabah and Pride Land and I am pretty sure that they would easily manage to create awesome NCPs for each world. In addition, we can't forget the NCPs from the original worlds like Twilight Town, Traverse Town and Radiant Garden.

Besides, it's way better to have NCPs in order to avoid awkward situations like:

- Olympus Coliseum, fans in the arena shouting for Hercules's winning, where are they?

- Castle of Dreams, having five people to attend the ball when INCLUDING the main characters of the world.

- Enchanted Dominion, Maleficent's mentioning of the sleeping people in the castle, which is...no one but Aurora?

- Disney Castle, Queen Minni's message to the people in the castle, who are only Chip and Dale? About the heartless's appearance.

- La Cite des Cloches, Quasimodo at the first scene on an elephant with no one around but voices.

- The Grid/ Port Royal/ Land of Dragon/ Agrabah/Country of the Musketeers awkward towns and streets where no one is walking. 

 

I would prefer having NCPs to cover such situations instead of worrying about how they would react when having enemies because the problem is easily solved when putting them in different safe places while putting some few of them in the dangerous places just to give life to the whole world...Just think of how FF XIII-2 managed to do that and it would become clear to you.

Imagine if the guards of Agrabah were actually there, wouldn't it be cool to see them damaging the heartless and fighting along instead of just dealing with everything by yourself? Imagine citizens in La Cite des Cloches throwing stones on the enemy as a way of helping, wouldn't it be awesome? Yeah true the NCPs might not give that big of a help, but spiritually man, you would feel that you're not alone and I've never felt of the importance of NCPs and how much such awesome series would need them until I've played BBS and 3D were I felt very very lonely especially in huge places like 3D's worlds were no one is around even the main characters.

So don't worry about that, I am pretty sure that Square Enix would deal with such things and I am pretty sure that they were intending to add NCPs but couldn't just to add space for other things. However, now things are different, we are talking about PS4 which would easily have space for all those details and we should all give faith to SE people

Edited December 6, 2015 by Master Keeper

[HeartlessAqua 38]

I think random NPCs during gameplay are unnecessary and might take away time and effort that could be put into developing more useful things for the games.

 

However, they would not necessarily ruin the games if they were included. As many people say, they would breathe some life into worlds which are supposed to be populated but look more like lifeless limbos. I personally don't mind lifeless limbos too much, in fact they give KH a weird neat style, but I can see the appeal in a few wandering NPCs in safe areas. The movies have plenty of "NPCs" anyway, in the form of incidental or background characters. KH does not need more NPCs, but if it did use more it could easily use some of those nameless figures.

 

At the very least, I would not mind simplistic models or sprites used to represent crowds in scenes that are clearly supposed to have crowds. Cinderella's ball was ridiculous!

 

And keep in mind that Traverse Town had plenty of NPCs in the first district, which I thought was nice. Really made the town feel like a place full of people, rather than some kind of creepy Disney version of Silent Hill. Not necessary, but very welcome.

Edited December 7, 2015 by HeartlessAqua

[Dio Brando 5,810]

It's quite simple:

 

Either leave them out of Battle Zones entirely.

 

Or:

 

Have them react accordingly.

 

We're not asking for Flash Mob levels of NPC's, just enough to give the worlds more life, rather than the barren wastelands they have been made to feel like. And while there are worlds in KH that are uninhabited, most are bustling towns or highly populated zones anyway, so the lack of people is suspect and immersion breaking.

 

And let's not forget Aladdin's comment about the people of Agrabah while the camera shows what looks like Agrabah after the Apocalypse.

"The action,the people"-Aladdin 

 

What action?What people?THERE IS NOBODY HERE

 

And don't even get me started on on the Ballroom scene in Birth by Sleep

[TheKingdomkid 1,194]

"The action,the people"-Aladdin 

 

What action?What people?THERE IS NOBODY HERE

 

And don't even get me started on on the Ballroom scene in Birth by Sleep

Or the cheers coming from literally no on in Olympus Coliseum in both Kingdom Hearts 2 and Birth by Sleep 

[Jiminy's Journal 13]

I've seen NPCs in battle areas work fine in Zelda.  They act as bystanders, but they're there.  Like that guard in North Clock Town — worst guard ever.

[GroovingOnUp 163]

 Few good points made here for Npcs.

 

The thing is now that Kh3 is on better hardware the lack of npcs will be far more noticeable than previous titles because the worlds are going to be even bigger and seamless too.

 

In previous kh games you could easily overlook the lack of npcs because of the hardware and fact that the worlds were also pretty small.But Now?The worlds are massive,it needs to be populated.

 

With the worlds being so massive there's going to be areas where heartless won't spawn so it won't be a problem.Just by looking at the e3 trailer i see a few areas you could put npcs.

[KingdomHearts3 2,591]

Uh, no. No NPCs. It will blow the game. They haven't put them in any game and they won't ever do so. With that being said, people should give up trying to persuade the KH3 team of putting them in or even complaining about NPCs absence.

Edited December 11, 2015 by KingdomHearts3

[GroovingOnUp 163]

It's like some people don't want to see this series improve,even if it's something small that can overall help the game.

 

People will never stop complaining about the lack of npcs,especially as the kh series continues to be on better hardware.

Edited December 11, 2015 by GroovingOnUp