The KH series should have a simpler story after the Xehanort saga

[Dio Brando 5,810]

I love this series to death believe me,but let's face it

 

with each game the series became as convoluted as the Metal Gear series if not more to the point that,while not hard for me to explain the story to myself,it's really hard to explain it to a newcomer who'll have hundreds of questions popping in his head the moment you tell him who Xehanort is

 

What I mean by simpler is,something along the lines of the first two KH games especially the first game,the story of KH1 didn't need that much complexity to be fun and epic at the same time,KH2 was more complex than the first game but I still found it easy to understand.

 

It's in the handheld games like Birth by Sleep,3582 days and DDD that newcomers will find themselves in absolute confusion,heck even veterans in the series might find the whole story of the series to be a mess the moment he starts getting headache just to solve one plot point,only to find that there are a bajillion more plot points to solve

 

 

Again,don't get me wrong I personally like complex stories in video games but there has to be a limit you have to reach before you draw the line.

 

 

Once the Xehanort saga is done and Xehanort no longer exist,I want Nomura and Square to simplify a story,make one consistent villain that doesn't divide himself into 13 figures that include his heartless and nobody and his other clones

 

 

And most importantly,Focus more on the main character himself rather than splitting the focus all over the place

 

Because if there is one thing that pissed me off about the KH series,is the overglorifying of BBS trio's roles in the story and how Nomura made them more important than they actually are

 

I know some of you may not agree,but remember that the charm of the first game in the series was that it's so simple to pick up and play by anyone as it emphasized the fact of it being a DisneySquare crossover more than any other game in the series aside from KH2.

 

You can only complicate a story so much before people draw the line and look for something else

 

Heck the Zelda Timeline is much easier to solve than this

 

And before you say anything,I know some other franchises that suffers the same problem and that includes the Metal Gear series

Edited February 13, 2014 by Metal Snake

[Nick Sideris 1,551]

I agree with ya in the general part . They should simplify the story over the next Saga but I can't agree with ya on the focusing-on-the-main-character part . The series involves Disney characters , FF characters and the original Kingdom Hearts characters . So yeah , the focus should be all over the other characters .

[Shana09 5,769]

 

 

Because if there is one thing that pissed me off about the KH series,is the overglorifying of BBS trio's roles in the story and how Nomura made them more important than they actually are

 

 

They are important.

 

1) Terra is the vessel of Xehanort. He really help Xehanort get away with his plan which led him to what he does right now.

2) Aqua is not dead, but hidden. As being a Keyblade Master too alive yet stuck, it'd be safe to say she needs to be saved for being a Light and a friend of Mickey.

3) Ven IS the most important. Having a connection of Sora and his Nobody being able to dual wield.

4) They are all three needed to complete the 7 Lights, but Terra may have to be excluded if he is still under MX's control

5) They are the reason Sora, Riku and Kairi could wield keyblades (Sora can dual wield though).

6) They are King Mickey's friends, and Mickey really wants to save them no matter what.

 

Anyways, I just hope they got take a brand new road when it comes to the next saga.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Shana09

[Dio Brando 5,810]

They are important.

 

1) Terra is the vessel of Xehanort. He really help Xehanort get away with his plan which led him to what he does right now.

2) Aqua is not dead, but hidden. As being a Keyblade Master too alive yet stuck, it'd be safe to say she needs to be saved for being a Light and a friend of Mickey.

3) Ven IS the most important. Having a connection of Sora and his Nobody and being a Keyblade wielder too.

4) They are all three needed to complete the 7 Lights, but Terra may have to be excluded if he is still under MX's control

5) They are the reason Sora, Riku and Kairi could wield keyblades.

6) They are King Mickey's friends, and Mickey really wants to save them no matter what.

 

Anyways, I just hope they got take a brand new road when it comes to the next saga.

I know they are important and you don't have to explain to me why because I played every single game in the series.

 

What I meant is,they're too important for their own good to the point the fanbase assume they're the ones that will take out Xehanort instead of Sora and Riku

 

Just look at the forums of KHInsider and how everybody wants Terra to defeat Xehanort

I agree with ya in the general part . They should simplify the story over the next Saga but I can't agree with ya on the focusing-on-the-main-character part . The series involves Disney characters , FF characters and the original Kingdom Hearts characters . So yeah , the focus should be all over the other characters .

OMG will you understand me??

 

I never said it should be a Sora-only story

 

I just said more emphasis instead of making TerraAquaVen seem more important than Sora

[Nick Sideris 1,551]

I know they are important and you don't have to explain to me why because I played every single game in the series.

 

What I meant is,they're too important for their own good to the point the fanbase assume they're the ones that will take out Xehanort instead of Sora and Riku

 

Just look at the forums of KHInsider and how everybody wants Terra to defeat Xehanort

OMG will you understand me??

 

I never said it should be a Sora-only story

 

I just said more emphasis instead of making TerraAquaVen seem more important than Sora

Alright ,calm down ,will ya ?

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Alright ,calm down ,will ya ?

It's one of the things I hate about the KH fanbase.

 

They made assumptions about the one who posts and take these assumptions as truth

 

I never said it should be Sora only.....read

[Nick Sideris 1,551]

It's one of the things I hate about the KH fanbase.

 

They made assumptions about the one who posts and take these assumptions as truth

 

I never said it should be Sora only.....read

DID I SAY THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT SORA ONLY ? I just said that there's no need to focus on the main characters , that's all . 

[KHUndertaleFan25 2,858]

DID I SAY THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT SORA ONLY ? I just said that there's no need to focus on the main characters , that's all . 

Dude, calm down. 

Edited February 13, 2014 by PrincessHearts25

[Dio Brando 5,810]

DID I SAY THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT SORA ONLY ? I just said that there's no need to focus on the main characters , that's all . 

"Tells me to calm down,then scream on me with caps"

 

So why are they called main characters then???

 

It's like if you play FFVII but instead of Cloud killing Sephiroth with Omnislash Barret suddenly comes out and blow Sephiroth's head.

 

What I meant is....They should let us spend more time with Sora instead of putting dozens of playable characters like how BBS forced you to replay every world three times

Edited February 13, 2014 by Metal Snake

[Nick Sideris 1,551]

"Tells me to calm down,then scream on me with caps"

 

So why are they called main characters then???

 

It's like if you play FFVII but instead of Cloud killing Sephiroth with Omnislash Barret suddenly comes out and blow Sephiroth's head.

 

What I meant is....They should let us spend more time with Sora instead of putting dozens of playable characters like how BBS forced you to replay every world three times

I am using caps because you insist on being rude . I have never played a single FF game so I don't know what they are all about . Anyways , I don't want to continue speculating about the games that will be released in 15 years so yeah let's just end this .

[KHUndertaleFan25 2,858]

I am using caps because you insist on being rude . I have never played a single FF game so I don't know what they are all about . Anyways , I don't want to continue speculating about the games that will be released in 15 years so yeah let's just end this .

That's good.

[MyDixieRect 2,061]

The story is really not that hard to get or explain at all.

[Geotrix 862]

My problem is that these side games are created to explain plot points which didn't need to be explained, do I really care how Kairi and Riku came to be able to wield a keyblade? Not really. If it keeps adding lots and lots of sidepoints it just detracts from the story instead of adding to it and ripening it up. DDD was the biggest offender for this, I get the plots of each time but you have to wade through a lot of crap in order to get there. I'm not saying have a simple story because having a more interesting tone adds more depth since this is a series and a simple plot for each game won't help us invest in the characters, it's nice to have substance. But at least simplify the more complex plot points to the point that they make sense instead of the player taking a step back saying "Wow, that was dumb" which  is starting to become the case. However I still adore KH and its plot for various reasons, but it is not wrong to admit that it adds in stuff which doesn't need to be there and that it is muddled as a result.

[DarkAvenger 88]

I see your point but still the more complex it is the more i like it.It brings up many questions and mysteries that make the game more interesting.(ex. Young Xehanort and time travel)

[Ruby Rose 8,591]

You think the story's convoluted now?

 

Just wait for the next saga- five times the Keyblades, ten times the time travel!!

[Dave 5,715]

They are important.

 

1) Terra is the vessel of Xehanort. He really help Xehanort get away with his plan which led him to what he does right now.

2) Aqua is not dead, but hidden. As being a Keyblade Master too alive yet stuck, it'd be safe to say she needs to be saved for being a Light and a friend of Mickey.

3) Ven IS the most important. Having a connection of Sora and his Nobody and being a Keyblade wielder too.

4) They are all three needed to complete the 7 Lights, but Terra may have to be excluded if he is still under MX's control

5) They are the reason Sora, Riku and Kairi could wield keyblades.

6) They are King Mickey's friends, and Mickey really wants to save them no matter what.

 

Anyways, I just hope they got take a brand new road when it comes to the next saga.

 

 

Here's the thing, though: the elements of Birth By Sleep only solved or explained problems that the game itself introduced. Things like Terra being Xehanort, Ven's connection to Sora, and the idea that they somehow have relations to why the main 3 can wield keyblades are only topics because the game introduced them and superimposed them upon the series after the fact. The game's canon from KH1-KH2 made sense on its own, and didn't require these additional elements in order to make sense of it. The only reason why the BBS crew seem so important is because they were forced upon the content, rather than being an integral part of the story itself.

[Shana09 5,769]

Here's the thing, though: the elements of Birth By Sleep only solved or explained problems that the game itself introduced. Things like Terra being Xehanort, Ven's connection to Sora, and the idea that they somehow have relations to why the main 3 can wield keyblades are only topics because the game introduced them and superimposed them upon the series after the fact. The game's canon from KH1-KH2 made sense on its own, and didn't require these additional elements in order to make sense of it. The only reason why the BBS crew seem so important is because they were forced upon the content, rather than being an integral part of the story itself.

 

That is true and I have thought of that. I was talking about how they are important in the current storyline rather than being just being forced.

[KHUndertaleFan25 2,858]

I'm only 13 and yet i understand the plot. I was only like 8 (I think. Can't remember how old i was when i found Kingdom Hearts, the first game, of course) when i first found Kingdom Hearts, then started to like it.

[Orchestrafanboy19 101]

I honestly don't find the story that convoluted. I find it irritating when people say it is.

My problem is that these side games are created to explain plot points which didn't need to be explained, do I really care how Kairi and Riku came to be able to wield a keyblade? Not really. If it keeps adding lots and lots of sidepoints it just detracts from the story instead of adding to it and ripening it up. DDD was the biggest offender for this, I get the plots of each time but you have to wade through a lot of crap in order to get there. I'm not saying have a simple story because having a more interesting tone adds more depth since this is a series and a simple plot for each game won't help us invest in the characters, it's nice to have substance. But at least simplify the more complex plot points to the point that they make sense instead of the player taking a step back saying "Wow, that was dumb" which  is starting to become the case. However I still adore KH and its plot for various reasons, but it is not wrong to admit that it adds in stuff which doesn't need to be there and that it is muddled as a result.

Birth by Sleep and 358/2 Days are NOT side-games. Birth by Sleep is as important to the plot as KH, CoM, KHII, and 3D. It urks me when people call them side-games. Nomura himself refers to them as such. They are very important to the overall plot of the series.

Here's the thing, though: the elements of Birth By Sleep only solved or explained problems that the game itself introduced. Things like Terra being Xehanort, Ven's connection to Sora, and the idea that they somehow have relations to why the main 3 can wield keyblades are only topics because the game introduced them and superimposed them upon the series after the fact. The game's canon from KH1-KH2 made sense on its own, and didn't require these additional elements in order to make sense of it. The only reason why the BBS crew seem so important is because they were forced upon the content, rather than being an integral part of the story itself.

The trio from Birth by Sleep have been alluded to since KHII. You say the overall canon of KHII makes sense on its own, but what about Xigbar's comments about, "He used to give me that exact same look," and, "You three don't look half the heroes the others were"? How would you go about explaining that if Birth by Sleep didn't exist? Keep in mind also, KHII came out several years before Birth by Sleep, so for Nomura to already have them in mind means that they are important.

[Dave 5,715]

 

The trio from Birth by Sleep have been alluded to since KHII. You say the overall canon of KHII makes sense on its own, but what about Xigbar's comments about, "He used to give me that exact same look," and, "You three don't look half the heroes the others were"? How would you go about explaining that if Birth by Sleep didn't exist? Keep in mind also, KHII came out several years before Birth by Sleep, so for Nomura to already have them in mind means that they are important.

 

I always assumed that both quotes referred to Roxas (and possibly Axel for the latter).

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

Yeah the series could dull down on the complicated concepts and focus on the quality rather then quantity.

 

They are important.

 

1) Terra is the vessel of Xehanort. He really help Xehanort get away with his plan which led him to what he does right now.

2) Aqua is not dead, but hidden. As being a Keyblade Master too alive yet stuck, it'd be safe to say she needs to be saved for being a Light and a friend of Mickey.

3) Ven IS the most important. Having a connection of Sora and his Nobody and being a Keyblade wielder too.

4) They are all three needed to complete the 7 Lights, but Terra may have to be excluded if he is still under MX's control

5) They are the reason Sora, Riku and Kairi could wield keyblades.

6) They are King Mickey's friends, and Mickey really wants to save them no matter what.

 

Anyways, I just hope they got take a brand new road when it comes to the next saga.

This except Ventus isn't the reason Sora can wield.

[Shana09 5,769]

Yeah the series could dull down on the complicated concepts and focus on the quality rather then quantity.

 

This except Ventus isn't the reason Sora can wield.

 

I meant dual wield sorry, I keep forgetting thats how Ven affected Sora.

Unless I am wrong about that also, sorry I am not great at KH lore.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Shana09

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

I meant dual wield sorry, I keep forgetting thats how Ven affected Sora.

Unless I am wrong about that also, sorry I am not great at KH lore.

It's all good

[Geotrix 862]

I honestly don't find the story that convoluted. I find it irritating when people say it is.

Birth by Sleep and 358/2 Days are NOT side-games. Birth by Sleep is as important to the plot as KH, CoM, KHII, and 3D. It urks me when people call them side-games. Nomura himself refers to them as such. They are very important to the overall plot of the series.

The trio from Birth by Sleep have been alluded to since KHII. You say the overall canon of KHII makes sense on its own, but what about Xigbar's comments about, "He used to give me that exact same look," and, "You three don't look half the heroes the others were"? How would you go about explaining that if Birth by Sleep didn't exist? Keep in mind also, KHII came out several years before Birth by Sleep, so for Nomura to already have them in mind means that they are important.

I refer to them as Side games as they are not part of the 'main line' of games (KH1,KH2,KH3) Not everyone is going to have the consoles/handhelds these are on (Mainly BBS on the PSP) But they have compensated with that for the remixes. Although I love BBS and DDD to an extent. They did not need to be created. BBS didn't need to be there, I respect that it is because I love the new trio and Xehanort but it didn't really need to be there in terms of plot.

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Yeah the series could dull down on the complicated concepts and focus on the quality rather then quantity.This except Ventus isn't the reason Sora can wield.

 Agreed 

 

 

 

This also gives you a look into why the plot ended up so complicated . They couldn't work on KH3 for quite some time so they had to do something to keep fans into the series while waiting for KH3- side games that had no choice but to expound on the plot or add more complicated plot points to give the games substance to work with so they decided to fill in blanks and add more details they prolly wouldn't have needed to do had they had the option to make KH3 a long time ago. I love complicated plots but there is a point where it stops being interesting and starts being annoying like when they added cheesy things like time travel  IMHO. This is what Nomura explained. :

 

 

RPG Site: It's appears it's all about sequels and spin-offs now. There were many Kingdom Hearts titles between II and III, while on the FF side we have sequels - X-2, XIII-2, Lighting Returns - and you've already announced FF15 will have sequels. How does planning for multiple titles at a time instead of just one effect you as a creator?

Nomura: To start, the reason why we have had so many Kingdom Hearts spin-off games... well, look - it's above your imagination, seriously, believe it or not - creating a HD game is unbelievably difficult. [laughs]

People think it's easy - even a HD remake like 1.5, they think 'Ah, easy job' - but it actually isn't like that at all. Everything is difficult in the process, even with a HD remaster of a game. For 1.5 for instance, when we decided to make it, we had to decide where we were going to concentrate because it was so difficult, there was so much work involved.

We'll likely spend the better part of the console generation with FF15's core cast via sequels. The main reason why we had so many spin-offs for Kingdom Hearts is because we couldn't start preparing for Kingdom Hearts III for a while - for a long time - because... well, because of some reasons, basically. However, if we didn't release any Kingdom Hearts games after the second at all, people might forget about the game, might forget about the series.

Obviously, I didn't want to do that - that's why we decided to make a spin-off game until the preparation for Kingdom Hearts III was ready to do.

So, in a way, because of this, if there were no spin-off games, there was no Kingdom Hearts III. It was kind of needed to have all those spin-offs - a lot of spin-offs - because the time was quite long before the Kingdom Hearts III preparation started.

With Final Fantasy, each game has a different reason why we decided to do sequels and stuff - for Final Fantasy X, for XIII... Of course, with Final Fantasy XV, we announced at E3 that there will - probably - be a sequel to this game, as well.

The story is really not that hard to get or explain at all.

 I feel like this too but for some it takes many explanations for them to understand. Even Nomura admitted this