KHBbS The "Two Hearts to Dual wield" thing is bullshit

[Dio Brando 5,810]

I know I bitched about Birth by Sleep a lot...but this point is so stupid it's hard to overlook because it offers a piss-poor explanation of a battle mechanic in KH2

 

Was Nomura drinking some beers with Zagnief when he was thinking of this idea???

 

Since when you ever heard of "You need two hearts to wield two of the same weapon" and thought of it as a good explanation???

 

And before you pull the bullshit that is "Sora can only wield the keyblade because of Ventus"....no he isn't.It was clearly explained that the Kingdom Key keyblade went to Sora when Riku joined the dark side and later on accepted it as it's new master

 

The only thing that Ven's heart add is dual wielding(The ability to wield two keyblades) and that's where I call bullshit.

 

In what fantasy or fiction did a warrior needed an extra heart to wield another blade and made any kind of sense???

 

Let's apply this thing on other examples to see how jarring it is:

 

Gilgamesh from FF5.....does he need six hearts to wield the six weapons he uses???

 

Let's take another stupid example shall we

 

Imagine you were in the world of Pokemon starting your Journey...you get your starter...you go the wild and right before you try to catch that Pidey,the words of Professor Oak echoes:HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLD IT.YOU NEED 5 MORE HEARTS IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO TRAIN 5 MORE POKEMON.......Doesn't make any sense now,does it?.

 

The Dual wield has never affected the story in any major way except for Roxas....who basically wields his own Keyblade and Sora's Keyblade due to their connection as a human and his nobody.....at least this make a little bit of sense than the two hearts crap

 

So why in the world does a gameplay mechanic in KH2 that doesn't affect neither the story or the cutscenes(except for Roxas) needs a half-assed explanation like this??

 

Sure Sora might use more Dual Wielding in KH3 from the descriptions we've seen so far about the new trailer.....BUT HE SHOULDN'T NEED AN EXTRA HEART TO BEGIN WITH

 

 

Kingdom Hearts is still my favorite series of all time,I still love it...but I hope for this explanation(which hasn't been mentioned in the game but by Nomura) to be either retconned or never implement it again

 

The Keyblade,even though it might be the strongest weapon,is still a sword no matter how you look at it just as the likes of Excalibur or even Soul Calibur and Soul Edge

[Demyx. 10,064]

It's because keyblades are connected to hearts. Unlike most weapons. 

[Shana09 5,769]

The Kingdom Hearts Franchise. Are you seriously saying that Kingdom Hearts has to come close to reality? Also, those are other franchises, why are you comparing a game that surrounds Hearts so much to a game that doesn't even remotely talk about hearts? Its a different universe, so different rules apply. Its a fantasy game for a reason. 

[AROD666 175]

u mad brah?

[Guest]

I know I bitched about Birth by Sleep a lot...but this point is so stupid it's hard to overlook because it offers a piss-poor explanation of a battle mechanic in KH2 Was Nomura drinking some beers with Zagnief when he was thinking of this idea??? Since when you ever heard of "You need two hearts to wield two of the same weapon" and thought of it as a good explanation??? And before you pull the bullshit that is "Sora can only wield the keyblade because of Ventus"....no he isn't.It was clearly explained that the Kingdom Key keyblade went to Sora when Riku joined the dark side and later on accepted it as it's new master The only thing that Ven's heart add is dual wielding(The ability to wield two keyblades) and that's where I call bullshit. In what fantasy or fiction did a warrior needed an extra heart to wield another blade and made any kind of sense??? Let's apply this thing on other examples to see how jarring it is: Gilgamesh from FF5.....does he need six hearts to wield the six weapons he uses??? Let's take another stupid example shall we Imagine you were in the world of Pokemon starting your Journey...you get your starter...you go the wild and right before you try to catch that Pidey,the words of Professor Oak echoes:HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLD IT.YOU NEED 5 MORE HEARTS IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO TRAIN 5 MORE POKEMON.......Doesn't make any sense now,does it?. The Dual wield has never affected the story in any major way except for Roxas....who basically wields his own Keyblade and Sora's Keyblade due to their connection as a human and his nobody.....at least this make a little bit of sense than the two hearts crap So why in the world does a gameplay mechanic in KH2 that doesn't affect neither the story or the cutscenes(except for Roxas) needs a half-assed explanation like this?? Sure Sora might use more Dual Wielding in KH3 from the descriptions we've seen so far about the new trailer.....BUT HE SHOULDN'T NEED AN EXTRA HEART TO BEGIN WITH  Kingdom Hearts is still my favorite series of all time,I still love it...but I hope for this explanation(which hasn't been mentioned in the game but by Nomura) to be either retconned or never implement it again The Keyblade,even though it might be the strongest weapon,is still a sword no matter how you look at it just as the likes of Excalibur or even Soul Calibur and Soul Edge

My thoughts. It makes no sense, and is basicly a cop out by Nomura.

[Gamerazor247 877]

The guns are probably gonna be like DmC devil may cry. You learn how to use them, than you think it's cool, than you never USE them again (unless necessary...).

[RoxSox 3,593]

Your problem here is that you're looking at a Keyblade like it's just a weapon. It's not. Keyblades are tied to the heart of the wielder. The keyblade originally meant for Riku wound up with Sora because he proved his heart was the stronger one (at that point in time at the least).

 

Sora had Ventus' heart within his body, just as Roxas did, and the fact that a keyblade is tied to the heart is what allows those two to weild two keyblades. It's not hard to understand, and it's not bullshit. The Keyblade is tied to the heart. It is not just a weapon. Two hearts means the capability to wield two keyblades.

[Shinigami 16]

Riku had 2 keyblades, he gave one to Kairi and he didn't have 2 hearts.

[CloakedSchemerX 1,011]

You can't compare a keyblade to many other weapons. None of Gilgamesh's bladed choose their owener for a strong heart, no, Gilgamesh got.it himself. The keyblades, though, choose. The Kingdom Key chose Sora, and Sora was able to use an extra keyblade because of Ven's heart within Sora's. Ven was chosen as well, therefore giving Sora an ability to dual wield.

 

The keyblade is meant to be a sole weapon, never supposed to have been dual wielded, because the keyblades themselves chose. No.Gungir or Masamune is going to be tied to one's heart

[Geotrix 862]

Riku had 2 keyblades, he gave one to Kairi and he didn't have 2 hearts.

I guess an explanation of that was he could only of held it until he gave it to Kairi, remember Leon and Captain Jack could hold a keyblade for a short amount of time aswell. 

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Your problem here is that you're looking at a Keyblade like it's just a weapon. It's not. Keyblades are tied to the heart of the wielder. The keyblade originally meant for Riku wound up with Sora because he proved his heart was the stronger one (at that point in time at the least).

 

Sora had Ventus' heart within his body, just as Roxas did, and the fact that a keyblade is tied to the heart is what allows those two to weild two keyblades. It's not hard to understand, and it's not bullshit. The Keyblade is tied to the heart. It is not just a weapon. Two hearts means the capability to wield two keyblades.

Yes the keyblade is tied to the heart of it's master

 

But that doesn't mean a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himher self with enough mastery and training

You can't compare a keyblade to many other weapons. None of Gilgamesh's bladed choose their owener for a strong heart, no, Gilgamesh got.it himself. The keyblades, though, choose. The Kingdom Key chose Sora, and Sora was able to use an extra keyblade because of Ven's heart within Sora's. Ven was chosen as well, therefore giving Sora an ability to dual wield.The keyblade is meant to be a sole weapon, never supposed to have been dual wielded, because the keyblades themselves chose. No.Gungir or Masamune is going to be tied to one's heart

Let's say Gilgamesh was a Keyblade Wielder....does that mean he needs six hearts to wield six blades ???

 

I know the keyblade is special and tied to it's master....heck the Keyblade is my favorite weapon....but the fact is....it's a weapon no matter how you look at it

 

Tied to it's master or not...the keyblade is made to be used by both good and evil

Edited October 14, 2013 by Metal Snake

[RoxSox 3,593]

Yes the keyblade is tied to the heart of it's master

 

But that doesn't mean a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himher self with enough mastery and training

 

That is pure speculation. You can't object to what's canon using your own speculation.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

That is pure speculation. You can't object to what's canon using your own speculation.

I can object with a canon point if that canon point IS TOTALLY UNNESSECARY AND MAKES NO SENSE

 

Sure the Keyblade is tied to it's master...but that doesn't nessecarily mean that a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himself

 

I can be possible that two keyblade can choose one master

Edited October 14, 2013 by Metal Snake

[Shinigami 16]

I guess an explanation of that was he could only of held it until he gave it to Kairi, remember Leon and Captain Jack could hold a keyblade for a short amount of time aswell. 

Yeah but Riku is definitely fit to wield a Keyblade whereas Leon and Jack are not.

[Geotrix 862]

Yes the keyblade is tied to the heart of it's master

 

But that doesn't mean a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himher self with enough mastery and training

Let's say Gilgamesh was a Keyblade Wielder....does that mean he needs six hearts to wield six blades ???

 

I know the keyblade is special and tied to it's master....heck the Keyblade is my favorite weapon....but the fact is....it's a weapon no matter how you look at it

 

Tied to it's master or not...the keyblade is made to be used by both good and evil

 

But the keyblade can only be tied to one heart, think of it as the Master Sword in LoZ which only Link can wield and have the power to wield it. I don't mind it at all it's not like it's such a big issue, you're comparing this to different media or games in general. It makes sense in Kingdom Hearts because of the Keyblade properties.

Yeah but Riku is definitely fit to wield a Keyblade whereas Leon and Jack are not.

But yeah he already has a keyblade but he can temporarily carry another one (lJack, Leon) I think this was just to give to Kairi.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

But the keyblade can only be tied to one heart, think of it as the Master Sword in LoZ which only Link can wield and have the power to wield it. I don't mind it at all it's not like it's such a big issue, you're comparing this to different media or games in general. It makes sense in Kingdom Hearts because of the Keyblade properties.

That doesn't mean two keyblades can't be tied to one heart

 

The Master Sword is a different story

 

It's been said that only the hero of time can wield it.....and it has been wielded by more than one Link,it has been used by different generations of link,and Link still can use another sword like the Goron Sword not just the Master Sword

 

Unlike the Master Sword,the keyblade properties hasn't been fully explained or even delved deep into

Edited October 14, 2013 by Metal Snake

[Sajirosky 0]

I've never heard this argument before. Is that why you have to sacrifice Goofy to be able to get valor form? And when you get master form, shouldn't Sora be able to weild 3 keyblades? What about Kairi, is this another reason why Sora can wield another Keyblade?

[Shana09 5,769]

I can object with a canon point if that canon point IS TOTALLY UNNESSECARY AND MAKES NO SENSE

 

Sure the Keyblade is tied to it's master...but that doesn't nessecarily mean that a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himself

 

I can be possible that two keyblade can choose one master

 

Think of it like this:

 

1 heart = 1 Keyblade

 

If 1 heart goes to a body already containing a heart, that Body gets 2 hearts.

If those 2 Hearts can materialize a Keyblade, then the Body gets 2 Keyblades.

 

It's not difficult as you are making it to be.

And it isn't a man-made weapon, its materialized by the strength of the wielders heart. 

[Shinigami 16]

 

But yeah he already has a keyblade but he can temporarily carry another one (lJack, Leon) I think this was just to give to Kairi.

Riku was never seen actually using both Keyblades but there was no explanation behind that. Who knows? Maybe he could have used both if he wanted to.

[Geotrix 862]

That doesn't mean two keyblades can't be tied to one heart

 

The Master Sword is a different story

 

It's been said that only the hero of time can wield it.....and it has been wielded by more than one Link,it has been used by different generations of link

 

Unlike the Master Sword,the keyblade properties hasn't been fully explained or even delved deep into

But two keyblades aren't tied to one heart.

As you said it's because of Sora has Vens heart inside him, the power of Vens keyblade is tied to Soras heart.

 

It may not be the best way to fill in something like this, but it's explained so I don't see what the problem is.

[RoxSox 3,593]

I can object with a canon point if that canon point IS TOTALLY UNNESSECARY AND MAKES NO SENSE

 

Sure the Keyblade is tied to it's master...but that doesn't nessecarily mean that a wielder can't tie two keyblades to himself

 

I can be possible that two keyblade can choose one master

 

Yes it does mean that, because if that's something that a keyblade wielder can do, then the series would give us an INDICATION THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THEY CAN DO. And who knows, maybe in the future, that will be something they can do, but for right now, there is absolutely nothing that suggests they can.

 

Like I said, you can't use rampant and baseless speculation to try and act like a canon plot point is some kind of fallacy.

 

If you think it's a stupid plot point, that's totally fine, more power to you. But you can't try to disprove something that's canon, do you know why? BECAUSE IT'S FREAKING CANON.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Think of it like this:

 

1 heart = 1 Keyblade

 

If 1 heart goes to a body already containing a heart, that Body gets 2 hearts.

If those 2 Hearts can materialize a Keyblade, then the Body gets 2 Keyblades.

 

It's not difficult as you are making it to be.

And it isn't a man-made weapon, its materialized by the strength of the wielders heart. ?

It hasn't been confirmed if the Keyblade isn't made by man or not

 

the period before the Keyblade war hasn't been shown and the creation of the keyblade is not fully known

 

not to mention there is so many keyblades in the Keyblade Graveyard

 

Which means that those Keyblades that the main characters wield might've belonged to another warrior during the keyblade war

But two keyblades aren't tied to one heart.

As you said it's because of Sora has Vens heart inside him, the power of Vens keyblade is tied to Soras heart.

 

It may not be the best way to fill in something like this, but it's explained so I don't see what the problem is.

I know they aren't,but they could've made them tied to one heart if the wielder has a strong heart and enough mastery

 

And you said it now,it's not the best way to fill something that never needed to be filled to begin with

Yes it does mean that, because if that's something that a keyblade wielder can do, then the series would give us an INDICATION THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THEY CAN DO. And who knows, maybe in the future, that will be something they can do, but for right now, there is absolutely nothing that suggests they can.

 

Like I said, you can't use rampant and baseless speculation to try and act like a canon plot point is some kind of fallacy.

 

If you think it's a stupid plot point, that's totally fine, more power to you. But you can't try to disprove something that's canon, do you know why? BECAUSE IT'S FREAKING CANON.

I didn't want to speculate

 

But they never needed to fill a plot point that never needed anything to fill it.

 

They could've just lift it as it was when it got introduced in KH2

[Geotrix 862]

It hasn't been confirmed if the Keyblade isn't made by man or not

 

the period before the Keyblade war hasn't been shown and the creation of the keyblade is not fully known

 

not to mention there is so many keyblades in the Keyblade Graveyard

 

Which means that those Keyblades that the main characters wield might've belonged to another warrior during the keyblade war

I know they aren't,but they could've made them tied to one heart if the wielder has a strong heart and enough mastery

 

And you said it now,it's not the best way to fill something that never needed to be filled to begin with

But that's making it your own canon, as RoxSox said it's fine if you don't like it, but you can't try and attempt to prove it wrong when it's been proved in the games itself that is the reason why it happens.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

But that's making it your own canon, as RoxSox said it's fine if you don't like it, but you can't try and attempt to prove it wrong when it's been proved in the games itself that is the reason why it happens.

I'm just speculating,not making my canon as,like I said,the period before the keyblade war hasn't been explained

 

And again I'm just speculating and anything can happen.

 

What I wanted to say is,they never needed to fill a plot point that never needed a filler to begin with

Edited October 14, 2013 by Metal Snake

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Your problem here is that you're looking at a Keyblade like it's just a weapon. It's not. Keyblades are tied to the heart of the wielder. The keyblade originally meant for Riku wound up with Sora because he proved his heart was the stronger one (at that point in time at the least).

 

Sora had Ventus' heart within his body, just as Roxas did, and the fact that a keyblade is tied to the heart is what allows those two to weild two keyblades. It's not hard to understand, and it's not bullshit. The Keyblade is tied to the heart. It is not just a weapon. Two hearts means the capability to wield two keyblades.

 

Pretty much this . Both Roxas and Sora wield Sora's and Ven's keyblades when they dual wield due to Ven's heart residing in Sora's physical body. The rule Nomura made for one keyblade one heart is the rule he chose to make . In the future , he MIGHT change this but until he does it's canon fact and that's all there is to say .If he decides to never change that rule then that's also his perogative. No need to get worked up over it .

 

Riku was never seen actually using both Keyblades but there was no explanation behind that. Who knows? Maybe he could have used both if he wanted to.

 Yes this has never been explained but maybe in KH3. However , wielders can hold other wielders keyblades . Just sayin'. Wait and see I guess.