7 Lights and 13 Darknesses

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

Q1: Why do Roxas and Ventus look alike?A: Because inside Sora, which is Roxas’ body, is Ventus’ heart. As was shown in the opening to BbS and the ending to Last Episode, Sora and Ventus’ heart are linked. And so Roxas, who is a part of Sora, was affected by that and looks just like Ventus...

It all comes down to your interpretation of these two lines.

I see the first line as meaning "Ventus is part of Sora, and thusly part of Roxas".This is the logistics of Roxas being Soras nobody, not saying that Roxas has Vens heart. And the second line basically confirms that interpretation, that Roxas looks like Ven because he was influenced by the connection between Sors and Ven, not because he has Vens heart.

Until I see Nomura explicitly saying the words "Roxas had Vens heart", then I won't believe it, and I won't argue the point.

*Q1: Why do Roxas and Ventus look alike?*

 

A: Because inside Sora, which is Roxas’ body, is Ventus’ heart. As was shown in the opening to BbS and the ending to Last Episode, Sora and Ventus’ heart are linked. And so Roxas, who is a part of Sora, was affected by that and looks just like Ventus.

 

This doesn't get any clearer then this. Roxas who is literally Sora's body was affected by Ventus's heart.

Since the heart shapes the vessel Sora's body was molded to look like Ventus as his heart remained in Sora's body. Had Ven's heart not been present Roxas would have looked like Sora not Ven.

 

 

*Q2: Why did Roxas faint in Castle Oblivion on Day 297?*

 

A: Because he had gotten to close to both Sora and Ventus, his “real self”.Before Day 297 in Days Sora had been to Castle Oblivion, as well as the fact that Ventus is asleep somewhere in the Room of Awakening. Both Sora and Ventus can be called Roxas’ “real selves”, and when he felt their presence it made him faint.

 

This further emulates the point about the location of Ven's heart. Roxas's fainted because Ven's heart was so close to his body, and Roxas(Sora's Body) was so close to his heart. Had Ven's heart not been within Roxas he woud not be included in Roxas's true selves.

 

 

*Q3 is basically the same question as 1 confirming Roxas has Ven's heart*

 

*Q4: Why can Roxas dual-wield?*

 

A: Because he can use both Sora’s and Ventus’ keyblades. Sora can wield two keyblades at once because he has Ventus’ as well as his own. As Roxas is a part of Sora, he also can use two. In Days Roxas awakened his ability to dual wield after fighting Xion. In KHII once, Sora absorbs him, he can also dual-wield.

 

Again if Roxas did not have Ven's heart he would have no means to access Ven's keyblade.

 

 

Nomura: Well, it isn’t that Roxas has physically inherited Xion’s keyblade, but more that Xion has awakened it within Roxas. In the KH series there are a lot of complex reasons why someone can use a keyblade, but basically you need a “heart” to be able to wield one. So strictly speaking, they are being influenced by Sora.

 

Again illustrating the same point.

Edited January 30, 2013 by devereauxr

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

*Q1: Why do Roxas and Ventus look alike?*A: Because inside Sora, which is Roxas’ body, is Ventus’ heart. As was shown in the opening to BbS and the ending to Last Episode, Sora and Ventus’ heart are linked. And so Roxas, who is a part of Sora, was affected by that and looks just like Ventus.This doesn't get any clearer then this. Roxas who is literally Sora's body was affected by Ventus's heart.Since the heart shapes the vessel Sora's body was molded to look like Ventus as his heart remained in Sora's body. Had Ven's heart not been present Roxas would have looked like Sora not Ven.*Q2: Why did Roxas faint in Castle Oblivion on Day 297?*A: Because he had gotten to close to both Sora and Ventus, his “real self”.Before Day 297 in Days Sora had been to Castle Oblivion, as well as the fact that Ventus is asleep somewhere in the Room of Awakening. Both Sora and Ventus can be called Roxas’ “real selves”, and when he felt their presence it made him faint.This further emulates the point about the location of Ven's heart. Roxas's fainted because Ven's heart was so close to his body, and Roxas(Sora's Body) was so close to his heart. Had Ven's heart not been within Roxas he woud not be included in Roxas's true selves.*Q3 is basically the same question as 1 confirming Roxas has Ven's heart**Q4: Why can Roxas dual-wield?*A: Because he can use both Sora’s and Ventus’ keyblades. Sora can wield two keyblades at once because he has Ventus’ as well as his own. As Roxas is a part of Sora, he also can use two. In Days Roxas awakened his ability to dual wield after fighting Xion. In KHII once, Sora absorbs him, he can also dual-wield.Again if Roxas did not have Ven's heart he would have no means to access Ven's keyblade.Nomura: Well, it isn’t that Roxas has physically inherited Xion’s keyblade, but more that Xion has awakened it within Roxas. In the KH series there are a lot of complex reasons why someone can use a keyblade, but basically you need a “heart” to be able to wield one. So strictly speaking, they are being influenced by Sora. Again illustrating the same point.

 

 

Yep, yep.yep and yep..Nomura reiterates this over and over and over where Ven's heart was.

[Ptolema 404]

I don't think Larxene and Marluxia will be Darknesses. And for some reason, Maleficent being an option made me laugh.

Edited January 30, 2013 by ElizaGreenstar

[Gambler'sApprentice 131]

One theory that I like, even if it is rediculous, is Xehanort  creating a bunch of superpowerful replicas, and then posessing them.

CoM and Days established they could have hearts, and it ensures that Xehanort can't run out of Darknesses.

[RoxSox 3,593]

Flaming Lea, Xaon: I still disagree with your interpretation (in all of those quotes, I still think theres varying interpretations of Nomuras answers. I'm not just looking at it blindly either. I've put myself in both our mindsets; I read all of them with your mindset, and interpreted them as meaning that Roxas has Vens heart, and it makes sense to me. And then I read it in my mindset, thinking that Roxas was influenced by Ven, and it still makes sense to me. I'm not just saying "we have different ways of looking at it", I'm saying that "it is written in such a way that there are two vastly different intrepretations, both making sense". You might not agree, and thats fine. Just lets stop arguing about it. I think its a grey area, you dont, and so lets leave it at that. It should have been left there from the beginning.

 

 

I am truthfully sorry if I came off like a dick. This argument happened on a particularly stressful day for me, and so I was kind of looking at everything with tired, angry eyes, and I wasn't thinking things through rationally. Again I apologize, and I hope that you'll forgive me.

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Flaming Lea, Xaon: I still disagree with your interpretation (in all of those quotes, I still think theres varying interpretations of Nomuras answers. I'm not just looking at it blindly either. I've put myself in both our mindsets; I read all of them with your mindset, and interpreted them as meaning that Roxas has Vens heart, and it makes sense to me. And then I read it in my mindset, thinking that Roxas was influenced by Ven, and it still makes sense to me. I'm not just saying "we have different ways of looking at it", I'm saying that "it is written in such a way that there are two vastly different intrepretations, both making sense". You might not agree, and thats fine. Just lets stop arguing about it. I think its a grey area, you dont, and so lets leave it at that. It should have been left there from the beginning.I am truthfully sorry if I came off like a dick. This argument happened on a particularly stressful day for me, and so I was kind of looking at everything with tired, angry eyes, and I wasn't thinking things through rationally. Again I apologize, and I hope that you'll forgive me.

 

 

It's all good but we will have to agree to disagree bc frankly Nomura has said numerous times in numerous ways that Roxas had Ven's heart.It's not an 'interpretation. " Nomura is known for his 'colorful choice of wording" but thats how he's always been .He still however made it quite clear through several points posted Roxas had Ven's heart . I can't force you to accept what's already been confirmed so we'll leave it at that .Just sayin'  

Edited January 31, 2013 by Flaming Lea

[Smithee 327]

He also said now that all the 13 darknesses were now there collected together and since Ven cant be a darkness you have no point .I  beg to differ on providing proof since you have none and you have admitted this on other threads on which you have lost this argument  over and over ,

 

I've never once "admitted" anything of the sort; now you're just putting words in my mouth.  Which you've done time and time again, I've noticed.

 

A vessel is defined as body with a piece of Master Xehanort's heart. In order for Ven to be considered a vessel his body would need to be implanted with Master Xehanort's heart. Bottom line a heart cannot be a vessel.

 

Except MX didn't say "vessels", he said "belong to me now".  I just explained that and why that could also apply to Ven's situation (fused with Sora, who was at that time an about-to-be vessel), and here you are putting words in my mouth just like FL.

 

Also, Nomura flat-out said MX's Heart-fragments are intended to take over the Darknesses' Hearts as well.

 

 

PS: Please stop Liking every single one of each other's posts just because you disagree with RoxSoxKH and me; it's really immature.

Edited February 1, 2013 by Alan Smithee

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

I've never once "admitted" anything of the sort; now you're just putting words in my mouth.  Which you've done time and time again, I've noticed.

 

 

Except MX didn't say "vessels", he said "belong to me now".  I just explained that and why that could also apply to Ven's situation (fused with Sora, who was at that time an about-to-be vessel), and here you are putting words in my mouth just like FL.

 

Also, Nomura flat-out said MX's Heart-fragments are intended to take over the Darknesses' Hearts as well.

 

 

PS: Please stop Liking every single one of each other's posts just because you disagree with RoxSoxKH and me; it's really immature.

 

NO whats immature is telling us who we can agree with on here bc you cant accept others think you are wrong. Liking ones post is to show you agree with them hence we like them ..You have admitted you can't dispute what we have said and agreed to stop arguing with us , did you not ? Don't lie . Also you have yet to prove one darn thing you have said yet we have provided proof after proof and used video after video to prove our points. Something you couldn't dispute EVER in  the past .

 

MX straight up said all 13 of his darknesses were now present in the room meaning Ven cannot be one of them considering his body is still in CO . MX cannot use Vens heart as a darkness bc MX needs his BODY for a vessel . Thats why he needed the organization to lose their hearts and become recusant in order to  use them as vessels. Ven cannot be used  for that until his body is found which hasnt happened yet . BUT MX SAID ALL  DARKNESSES WERE COMPLETELY GATHERED TOGETHER NOW THAT HE HAD SORA.. Your theory makes no sense and you have yet to give plausible proof to back yourself up but everything we presented to you was stated IN GAME and is canon.

Edited February 1, 2013 by Flaming Lea

[MythrilMagician 6,963]

This. And Beta I think Xehanort said that lights are three man short not two,but when they saved Sora they were two man short and I think that Lea and Kairi are going to be lights...

kairi yes 

lea no

[Ajexmi 446]

Flaming Lea, Xaon: I still disagree with your interpretation (in all of those quotes, I still think theres varying interpretations of Nomuras answers. I'm not just looking at it blindly either. I've put myself in both our mindsets; I read all of them with your mindset, and interpreted them as meaning that Roxas has Vens heart, and it makes sense to me. And then I read it in my mindset, thinking that Roxas was influenced by Ven, and it still makes sense to me. I'm not just saying "we have different ways of looking at it", I'm saying that "it is written in such a way that there are two vastly different intrepretations, both making sense". You might not agree, and thats fine. Just lets stop arguing about it. I think its a grey area, you dont, and so lets leave it at that. It should have been left there from the beginning.I am truthfully sorry if I came off like a dick. This argument happened on a particularly stressful day for me, and so I was kind of looking at everything with tired, angry eyes, and I wasn't thinking things through rationally. Again I apologize, and I hope that you'll forgive me.

 

Man, as an outsider I have to say you are repeating the same points which Flaming Lea has tackled in more ways than one. If you cannot accept the information as fact, then the least you can do is accept it as an opinion, instead of forcing your own opinion forward (and god-damn, you couldn't of picked anyone worse to argue with than our resident expert!

 

NO whats immature is telling us who we can agree with on here bc you cant accept others think you are wrong. Also you have yet to prove one darn thing you have said yet we have provided proof after proof and used video after video to prove our points. Something you couldn't dispute EVER in  the past .

 

MX straight up said all 13 of his darknesses were now present in the room meaning Ven cannot be one of them considering his body is still in CO . MX cannot use Vens heart as a darkness bc MX needs his BODY for a vessel . Thats why he needed the organization to lose their hearts and become recusant in order to  use them as vessels. Ven cannot be used  for that until his body is found which hasnt happened yet . BUT MX SAID ALL  DARKNESSES WERE COMPLETELY GATHERED TOGETHER NOW THAT HE HAD SORA.. Your theory makes no sense and you have yet to give plausible proof to back yourself up but everything we presented to you was stated IN GAME and is canon.

 

^ this. Cheers for making me realise that a Ven/Vanitas vessel is almost impossible

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Man, as an outsider I have to say you are repeating the same points which Flaming Lea has tackled in more ways than one. If you cannot accept the information as fact, then the least you can do is accept it as an opinion, instead of forcing your own opinion forward (and god-damn, you couldn't of picked anyone worse to argue with than our resident expert!

 

 

^ this. Cheers for making me realise that a Ven/Vanitas vessel is almost impossible

 

 

LOL and no problem .Glad to help anytime my friend Although Vanitas can possibly still be a darkness if hes picked from the past or other options like that. It's just Ven whose body is unavailable as a vessel right now

Edited February 1, 2013 by Flaming Lea

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

I've never once "admitted" anything of the sort; now you're just putting words in my mouth.  Which you've done time and time again, I've noticed.

 

 

 

Except MX didn't say "vessels", he said "belong to me now".  I just explained that and why that could also apply to Ven's situation (fused with Sora, who was at that time an about-to-be vessel), and here you are putting words in my mouth just like FL.

 

Also, Nomura flat-out said MX's Heart-fragments are intended to take over the Darknesses' Hearts as well.

 

 

PS: Please stop Liking every single one of each other's posts just because you disagree with RoxSoxKH and me; it's really immature.

A Seeker of Darkness refers to the twelve vessels with implanted with a piece of Master Xehanort's heart referring to someone as belonging to his side is referring to them as a Seeker of Darkness. Considering that both Mickey and MX are discussing who is on whose side I think it's pretty obvious what he's talking about. Also Ven's heart is not fused with Sora's it is merely seeking refuge there is a fine difference between the two. Considering he had already listed Terra as on of his vessels I think it's also obvious who he was referring to. Remember the point of the Organization was "To divide Xehanort's heart amongst thirteen vessels". Also there is no such evidence to suggest that Master Xehanort even knows where Ven's heart is. You insist on arguing this point but have provided no evidence to pack up your claims.

 

P.S Don't tell me what to do with my likes I'm tired of people telling me whose stuff I can and cannot like. FYI I liked their posts not because they disagreed with you but because they made valid points while you and roxsox have not. When you make one then I'll like a post of yours. It's actually ridiculous I have to explain that to you or anyone else because quite frankly I shouldn't have to. The fact that you're whining about it is really immature

[Smithee 327]

I've been nothing but patient with you guys, but it's like you're deliberately trying to piss me off.  I've provided the so-called "proof" you seek, and even when faced with direct quotes, you keep trying to twist my words to make yourselves sound right.  For the last firetrucking time, Ven's Heart would've "belonged to (MX)" just as much as Sora's, not "become a vessel".  You just do not listen, no matter how many times I repeat myself.

 

I'm out of this thread.  Permanently.  It's not worth my time to argue with trolls like you.

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

I've been nothing but patient with you guys, but it's like you're deliberately trying to piss me off.  I've provided the so-called "proof" you seek, and even when faced with direct quotes, you keep trying to twist my words to make yourselves sound right.  For the last firetrucking time, Ven's Heart would've "belonged to (MX)" just as much as Sora's, not "become a vessel".  You just do not listen, no matter how many times I repeat myself.

 

I'm out of this thread.  Permanently.  It's not worth my time to argue with trolls like you.

 

 

Oh yes we are 'trolls " bc we proved you wrong .Grow up.You have not provided proof and I have explained to you upteen times why your explanation rings false .I haven't twisted your words, you just refuse to address our points that prove you wrong bc you cant . FOR THE LAST TIME = MX SAID ALL 13 darknesses were gathered now that sora was there .  VEN cannot be a vessel till his body is found. YOUR argument is invalid.I saw what you wrote .YOU are the one who won't listen to why you are wrong.

[Robbie the Wise 5,050]

I've been nothing but patient with you guys, but it's like you're deliberately trying to piss me off.  I've provided the so-called "proof" you seek, and even when faced with direct quotes, you keep trying to twist my words to make yourselves sound right.  For the last firetrucking time, Ven's Heart would've "belonged to (MX)" just as much as Sora's, not "become a vessel".  You just do not listen, no matter how many times I repeat myself.

 

I'm out of this thread.  Permanently.  It's not worth my time to argue with trolls like you.

For the last time there has never been anything to suggest that Master Xehanort even knew where Ven's heart was so it's implausible to say that Ven was includeded in that. However once again he did refer to Terra as being his side, it doesn't take rocket science to figure out who he is talking about.

[KingdomHearts3 2,591]

I believe the seven lights are:

Ventus

Terra

Aqua

Sora

Riku

Kairi

Mickey

 

All of this exactly as Mickey said. I don't think Roxas will be one because he went back to Sora. Even though Sora says he has every right to be his person, Roxas counters saying that's the reason it must be him and showing Sora all of his memories. Terra will return as a light. He told Xehanort that he'll be shown the "door" meaning that Terra will kick him out from his heart. He has been mentioned as one of the three youths that need to be saved even though he'll be the hardest one to save. If he wasn't going to be saved, then:

1. Nomura wasted his time and energy developing him

2. It contradicts Yen Sid's confirmation that the three youths need to be awakened

3. Terra lied when he said that the old man will be shown the "door" and when he said that he'll keep on fighting.

 

So that's all I think.

[Isamu Kuno 2,512]

What if they where 

Aqua

Sora

Riku

Micky

Heyner

Pence

Olette

 

Nomura did say that the identities of the Seven Lights would be surprising. What would be more surprising than the only three OCs who have not had any part in the battle.

 

I personally believe that it will be the group shown in the opening. This can be done without the use of time travel

 

Riku, having gained the power to enter other peoples hearts and broken free of Xehanort's grasp himself can help Terra do the same.

 

When Sora returns Ven's heart to him Roxas can be reborn. The only flaw with this one would be if the original body absolutely has to disappear for this to happen since Sora  will never become a Heartless again.

Edited March 28, 2013 by Sora_Kuno

[Reyn 1,755]

I'm sure Aqua, Ven, Terra, Kairi, Riku, Mickey, and Lea will be keyblade wielders.

 

Kairi is a princess of heart, so she has no darkness at all, meaning she won't ever be a Darkness, unless she's corrupted or something.

 

Riku has a natural resistance to darkness thanks to Ansem, otherwise, He might've chosen to be the 13th vessel, rather than Sora in DDD.

 

Ventus has had his darkness expelled (thanks to Xehanort seperating Vanitas from him), and has probably very little to no Darkness.

 

Lea i'm sure isn't the kinda guy to go with the Darknesses, at least not anymore.

 

Mickey is a king, and with friends like Donald and Goofy around, he'll stay on the Light side, i'm sure.

 

Aqua has been a good Keyblade master, always Championing her friends, and since she stayed in the realm of darkness for 11 YEARS, i think maybe she's developed a resistance to darkness by now.

 

Terra will probably be saved, and Riku will show him how he developed a resistance to darkness, so he can do the same, while still wielding it.

 

The reason i didn't include Sora, is because if Ventus is freed, the keyblade will leave him, due to it not thinking he is worthy to wield it(I mean, Sora having the heart of a keyblade wielder inside of him, is the only reason the Keyblade chose him after Riku was taken by the Darkness in KH1).

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

I'm sure Aqua, Ven, Terra, Kairi, Riku, Mickey, and Lea will be keyblade wielders.

 

Kairi is a princess of heart, so she has no darkness at all, meaning she won't ever be a Darkness, unless she's corrupted or something.

 

Riku has a natural resistance to darkness thanks to Ansem, otherwise, He might've chosen to be the 13th vessel, rather than Sora in DDD.

 

Ventus has had his darkness expelled (thanks to Xehanort seperating Vanitas from him), and has probably very little to no Darkness.

 

Lea i'm sure isn't the kinda guy to go with the Darknesses, at least not anymore.

 

Mickey is a king, and with friends like Donald and Goofy around, he'll stay on the Light side, i'm sure.

 

Aqua has been a good Keyblade master, always Championing her friends, and since she stayed in the realm of darkness for 11 YEARS, i think maybe she's developed a resistance to darkness by now.

 

Terra will probably be saved, and Riku will show him how he developed a resistance to darkness, so he can do the same, while still wielding it.

 

The reason i didn't include Sora, is because if Ventus is freed, the keyblade will leave him, due to it not thinking he is worthy to wield it(I mean, Sora having the heart of a keyblade wielder inside of him, is the only reason the Keyblade chose him after Riku was taken by the Darkness in KH1).

 

 

Actually Nomura has already stated that Sora was always destined to wield and that the only thing Ven's heart gave him was the ability to dual wield .When Ven's heart returns Sora will only lose his dual wielding .. Sora wields his own keyblade even after Vens heart was in Roxas when Roxas was born .Sora was a walking heart from the end of Kh1 till Kh2 when Roxas rejoined him and still was wielding his keyblade without Ven's heart inside him .( which was in Roxas )

[Reyn 1,755]

Actually Nomura has already stated that Sora was always destined to wield and that the only thing Ven's heart gave him was the ability to dual wield .When Ven's heart returns Sora will only lose his dual wielding .. Sora wields his own keyblade even after Vens heart was in Roxas when Roxas was born .Sora was a walking heart from the end of Kh1 till Kh2 when Roxas rejoined him and still was wielding his keyblade without Ven's heart inside him .( which was in Roxas )

Really? O_O I'm surprised Terra didn't see the potential within Sora in BBS. Oh ok then. I always thought that it didn't really matter between the end of KH 1 -2 that Sora didn't physically have his heart in him, since Roxas is still part of  him, so i thought it still counted.

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Really? O_O I'm surprised Terra didn't see the potential within Sora in BBS. Oh ok then. I always thought that it didn't really matter between the end of KH 1 -2 that Sora didn't physically have his heart in him, since Roxas is still part of  him, so i thought it still counted.

 

Well Aqua saw Sora's potential but didn't give him the ceremony when she sensed Riku had received it .She didnt want it to interfere in their friendship so she didnt .

[Reyn 1,755]

Well Aqua saw Sora's potential but didn't give him the ceremony when she sensed Riku had received it .She didnt want it to interfere in their friendship so she didnt .

Ok then.

 

Too bad they still ended up fighting with each other in KH 1.

Edited March 28, 2013 by spiderfreak1011

[HarLea Quinn 26,501]

Ok then.

 

Too bad they still ended up fighting with each other in KH 1.

 

Oh the irony xDDD

[Reyn 1,755]

Oh the irony xDDD

Exactly.

[blazing 37]

What if they where 

Aqua

Sora

Riku

Micky

Heyner

Pence

Olette

 

Nomura did say that the identities of the Seven Lights would be surprising. What would be more surprising than the only three OCs who have not had any part in the battle.

 

I personally believe that it will be the group shown in the opening. This can be done without the use of time travel

 

Riku, having gained the power to enter other peoples hearts and broken free of Xehanort's grasp himself can help Terra do the same.

 

When Sora returns Ven's heart to him Roxas can be reborn. The only flaw with this one would be if the original body absolutely has to disappear for this to happen since Sora  will never become a Heartless again.

I think you are right becuase, you remember when Roxas said Hayner, Pence, Olette! and, everything went unfrozed. Maybe that could be true.

I think this is the 13 Seekers of Darkness: Bold Means Confirmed

Terranort

Xemnas

Braig

Isa Or Saix I forget

Xehanort

Young Xehanort

Ansem

Ansem-Riku

Sora or Vantius

Xion

???

???