Final Fantasy VIII

[Jim 2,990]

...I felt like getting your guys' opinions on something. Anyone else here think that Ultimecia is a really crappy main antagonist? As far as I can tell, she really doesn't have any real reason for doing the things she does. I'm replaying it again now to get another taste of the story, so I can see if there's anything more to what she's trying to accomplish. But really, what's to gain in compressing time so that only she can exist?

 

I mean, I like antagonists who have a goal, and have an an actual motive for accomplishing that goal. Examples:

• Moriarti, from the Sherlock Holmes movie (and books too, obviously)- Knew that there would be an inevitable world war, and cleverly chose to profit from it.
• Xehanort- Ultimately, he's trying to bring peace back to the worlds with his endeavors, but his methods become too warped to be morally acceptable.
• Veidt, from Watchmen- Looked at the bigger picture and killed millions to save billions.

These guys all have a reason, something that they, or other people could benefit from, with their plans. Ultimecia has none, as far as I know. Feel free to prove me wrong though. What's your opinion on this?

[xBerserkerSaix07x 125]

like ur sig

[hatok 6,413]

VIII focused too much on a 'love story' and the focus of the rest of the story was lost in the process.

Which wouldn't be THAT bad, but the 'love story' is pretty terrible...

Ultemecia, to me, seems more like they just needed a final boss, so they threw all the other sorceresses into a blender and this is the result.

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/11/2012 at 1:47 AM, 'xBerserkerSaix07x' said:

like ur sig

 

Thanks!

 

 

  On 7/11/2012 at 1:47 AM, 'hatok' said:

VIII focused too much on a 'love story' and the focus of the rest of the story was lost in the process.

Which wouldn't be THAT bad, but the 'love story' is pretty terrible...

Ultemecia, to me, seems more like they just needed a final boss, so they threw all the other sorceresses into a blender and this is the result.

 

Agreed. Also, it seemed like a big whoop-de-doo that all the party members just so happened to have been in the same orphanage when they were little, and the story was filled with crap like that. They just threw in pointless plot elements to make it seem better/cooler than it was. The gameplay was great though, so that made up for it a bit.

[islandboy461 47]

Would just like to point out that, in Conan Doyle's stories, Moriarty has no grand aims like his Ritchie counterpart. He is simply a very smart criminal who stars in about one story and is mentioned in a few others.

[Dave 5,715]

The whole problem with VIII is that it tries too hard to be complicated, rather than just focusing on a solid story. I always got the feeling it wanted to top the level of epic storytelling established by Final Fantasies past, and to that end, it introduced a ton of plot elements that weren't needed, characters that weren't developed, and just came off as a mess. Things like Ultimecia trying to compress time, the Laguna flashbacks, the orphanage connection, and the entire time travel thread, all wound up being underdeveloped and failed to meet the quality payoff intended. It was a story that needed some trimming, and someone to say, "Yeah, this might look cool on paper, but is it necessary?"

 

Not helping matters is that it takes so long for Ultimecia to be introduced that the player feels that nothing is emotionally at stake when facing her. The Sorceress, or even Siefer, would have made for a better main antagonist if only because Squall and the player are more familiar with them, and have a greater desire to defeat them.

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/11/2012 at 3:16 AM, 'Dave' said:

The whole problem with VIII is that it tries too hard to be complicated, rather than just focusing on a solid story. I always got the feeling it wanted to top the level of epic storytelling established by Final Fantasies past, and to that end, it introduced a ton of plot elements that weren't needed, characters that weren't developed, and just came off as a mess. Things like Ultimecia trying to compress time, the Laguna flashbacks, the orphanage connection, and the entire time travel thread, all wound up being underdeveloped and failed to meet the quality payoff intended. It was a story that needed some trimming, and someone to say, "Yeah, this might look cool on paper, but is it necessary?"

 

Not helping matters is that it takes so long for Ultimecia to be introduced that the player feels that nothing is emotionally at stake when facing her. The Sorceress, or even Siefer, would have made for a better main antagonist if only because Squall and the player are more familiar with them, and have a greater desire to defeat them.

 

You make great posts, you know that?

[Dave 5,715]

  On 7/11/2012 at 6:50 AM, 'hatok' said:

You make great posts, you know that?

 

Thank you.

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/11/2012 at 3:16 AM, 'Dave' said:

The whole problem with VIII is that it tries too hard to be complicated, rather than just focusing on a solid story. I always got the feeling it wanted to top the level of epic storytelling established by Final Fantasies past, and to that end, it introduced a ton of plot elements that weren't needed, characters that weren't developed, and just came off as a mess. Things like Ultimecia trying to compress time, the Laguna flashbacks, the orphanage connection, and the entire time travel thread, all wound up being underdeveloped and failed to meet the quality payoff intended. It was a story that needed some trimming, and someone to say, "Yeah, this might look cool on paper, but is it necessary?"

 

Not helping matters is that it takes so long for Ultimecia to be introduced that the player feels that nothing is emotionally at stake when facing her. The Sorceress, or even Siefer, would have made for a better main antagonist if only because Squall and the player are more familiar with them, and have a greater desire to defeat them.

 

You hit the nail right on the head. Awesome explanation.

 

 

  On 7/11/2012 at 2:38 AM, 'islandboy461' said:

Would just like to point out that, in Conan Doyle's stories, Moriarty has no grand aims like his Ritchie counterpart. He is simply a very smart criminal who stars in about one story and is mentioned in a few others.

 

Actually, and call me a noob all you want, I never read any of the books, I only saw the movie. Yeah, I'm not a legit fan, I just enjoyed the movie

[KHSonic 41]

I would put an opiniom but I just started playing it for the first time so i cant be spoiled by reading any of the comments. I'm not even to the part where she comes in yet. lol

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/12/2012 at 5:47 AM, 'KHSonic' said:

I would put an opiniom but I just started playing it for the first time so i cant be spoiled by reading any of the comments. I'm not even to the part where she comes in yet. lol

 

Heh, without giving anything away... you won't be there for a LOOOONG while.

[esumsoraroxas 48]

Personally, I like FFVIII because of the song, "Waltz For the Moon" and the romantic aspects of the plot.

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/15/2012 at 8:52 PM, 'esumsoraroxas' said:

Personally, I like FFVIII because of the song, "Waltz For the Moon" and the romantic aspects of the plot.

 

Don't get me wrong, I liked the game too. The battle system, music, and limit breaks were all excellent (except for Angelo Cannon lol). The story was the only real problem I had with it. But hey, no game's perfect.

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/15/2012 at 11:47 PM, 'Jim' said:

Don't get me wrong, I liked the game too. The battle system, music, and limit breaks were all excellent (except for Angelo Cannon lol). The story was the only real problem I had with it. But hey, no game's perfect.

 

I just have to say, the battle system is only great if you invest a tonne of time into it. It's for that reason I don't want to replay VIII...

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/15/2012 at 11:49 PM, 'hatok' said:

I just have to say, the battle system is only great if you invest a tonne of time into it. It's for that reason I don't want to replay VIII...

 

I'm guessing you're talking about all the drawing of magic you do over the course of the game. What I do is draw a lot of magic near the beginning, then try to focus on getting higher level spells through GF abilities and the like through the rest of it. After you refine yourself a lot of spells, you don't need to draw anywhere near as much.

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/15/2012 at 11:53 PM, 'Jim' said:

I'm guessing you're talking about all the drawing of magic you do over the course of the game. What I do is draw a lot of magic near the beginning, then try to focus on getting higher level spells through GF abilities and the like through the rest of it. After you refine yourself a lot of spells, you don't need to draw anywhere near as much.

 

I did that too, and I played Triple Triad. It still takes a good while, especially to get spells like Meltdown... and Ultima.

DEAR GOD! ULTIMA! AUUUUGGGH!

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/15/2012 at 11:55 PM, 'hatok' said:

I did that too, and I played Triple Triad. It still takes a good while, especially to get spells like Meltdown... and Ultima.

DEAR GOD! ULTIMA! AUUUUGGGH!

 

Never played Triple Triad, just because I usually don't bother with the main hobby sidequests of the FF games (Triple Triad, the FF9 card game, blitzball). I feel like I was able to get a crapload of Meltdowns from...was it Bombs? Not quite sure, but I feel like I was able to get some pretty easily

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/16/2012 at 12:00 AM, 'Jim' said:

Never played Triple Triad, just because I usually don't bother with the main hobby sidequests of the FF games (Triple Triad, the FF9 card game, blitzball). I feel like I was able to get a crapload of Meltdowns from...was it Bombs? Not quite sure, but I feel like I was able to get some pretty easily

 

I'm fairly certain Meltdown can only be gotten from bosses.

There's no point in playing Tetra Master in 9, but Triple Triad is the ideal way to get tonnes of items and spells. Early on, you can get an Angelo card which can be broken down into 100 Elixirs! Blitzball isn't as useful as Triple Triad, but it still offers some great items, not to mention Wakka's ultimate weapon ingredients and overdrives.

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/16/2012 at 12:03 AM, 'hatok' said:

I'm fairly certain Meltdown can only be gotten from bosses.

There's no point in playing Tetra Master in 9, but Triple Triad is the ideal way to get tonnes of items and spells. Early on, you can get an Angelo card which can be broken down into 100 Elixirs! Blitzball isn't as useful as Triple Triad, but it still offers some great items, not to mention Wakka's ultimate weapon ingredients and overdrives.

 

Exactly why I never used Wakka. I should give it a try next time I play FFX though

[hatok 6,413]

  On 7/16/2012 at 12:05 AM, 'Jim' said:

Exactly why I never used Wakka. I should give it a try next time I play FFX though

 

Blitzball becomes painfully easy once you get the ball rolling with Tidus. I ground up tonnes of items while reading a book/playing FF tactics, because it eventually required next to no effort on my part.

And really, in FFX, you should be using everybody, considering the whole rock paper scissors thing they have with enemies...

(Not that you really need anything besides dualcast Yuna with Ultima, and a full overdrive bar... (The Magus Sisters don't hurt either))

[esumsoraroxas 48]

  On 7/15/2012 at 11:47 PM, 'Jim' said:

 

Don't get me wrong, I liked the game too. The battle system, music, and limit breaks were all excellent (except for Angelo Cannon lol). The story was the only real problem I had with it. But hey, no game's perfect.

 

My first impressions of the game were, "Cool logo!", "Isn't this supposed to be a love story?", and "Awesome waltz song!". I never understood what "Angelo Cannon" did, similar to your experience with that Limit Break. lol

[Jim 2,990]

  On 7/16/2012 at 12:13 AM, 'esumsoraroxas' said:

My first impressions of the game were, "Cool logo!", "Isn't this supposed to be a love story?", and "Awesome waltz song!". I never understood what "Angelo Cannon" did, similar to your experience with that Limit Break. lol

 

Yeah, I just thought it was a dumb limit break lol. I mean, shooting a dog and having him cause an explosion? WUT?! (But being the mature person that I am, I renamed Angelo "Poop". Seeing "Poop Cannon" pop up on the screen made me chuckle like a three year old every time I've seen it so far...yeah I'm an idiot)

[esumsoraroxas 48]

  On 7/16/2012 at 12:18 AM, 'Jim' said:

 

Yeah, I just thought it was a dumb limit break lol. I mean, shooting a dog and having him cause an explosion? WUT?! (But being the mature person that I am, I renamed Angelo "Poop". Seeing "Poop Cannon" pop up on the screen made me chuckle like a three year old every time I've seen it so far...yeah I'm an idiot)

 

Lol "Poop Cannon!" Man...