Hoshiko Hikari 300 Posted January 6, 2018 I couldn't find another post about this so I hope I'm not repeating a topic already discussed. And I hope I'm not stating something that was really obvious to everyone else. Also if you are not up to date on the Union Cross NA storyline then look away now to avoid spoilers. I was going through a list of all currently known Keyblade Masters in my head the other day (as you do) when I suddenly realised something that I'd never thought about before. Ventus is a Keyblade Master! Probably, anyway. How is he a Keyblade Master, do you ask? Because in Union Cross he appears as one of the new Union Leaders chosen by the Master of Masters to replace the Foretellers (who are also Keyblade Masters) after they meet their end in the Keyblade War. And when Master Ava first tells Ephemer that he has been chosen to replace her as another one of the new Union Leaders he indicates that this also means he has been made a Master. Therefore if Ephemer has become a Master then we can assume that the other new Union Leaders are also Masters, including Ven. So if Ven is a Keyblade Master then that means - assuming he is one and the same as Ven in Birth By Sleep where he appears slightly older - that the whole time he was training with Aqua and Terra and sharing their dream of becoming Keyblade Masters, he was already a Keyblade Master but just didn't know it. I think this is a pretty interesting realisation when you consider that he is not only younger than Terra and Aqua by a few years (in appearance anyway as we don't actually know how old he is) but he is also weaker than them. It also means that Terra is the only one of the three to have not yet obtained the title of Master despite appearing to be the oldest. That would make him really depressed if he found out! On a slightly different note, why do you think Ven was chosen by the Master of Masters for this role? He says so himself that he's not particularly good at anything and never in the top ranks. He doesn't really seem to be a natural leader either. My guess is that he was chosen for his strong resistance to darkness. Though I also wonder if it's because the Master of Masters knew what lay in his future? Please share your thoughts! 4 Ventus_, Master Keeper, The Transcendent Key and 1 other reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doco56 52 Posted January 6, 2018 Ava chose the new union leaders did she not? Not the MoM. Or did MoM manipulate it someway? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ITzDarthLordRevan 291 Posted January 6, 2018 (edited) I'm pretty sure Ava did pick them. We clearly saw Ava give strelitzia one of the books that she was giving to all the new Union leaders. Four of them are dandelions that were hand-picked by Ava, not the MoM. MoM simply gave Ava the order the pick a group of Keyblade Wielders that would go on to survive passed the Keyblade War. MoM did not specify what people she should've chosen. She picked the people who she saw fit. Edited January 6, 2018 by ITzDarthLordRevan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Transcendent Key 12,109 Posted January 7, 2018 Well, Ventus is definitely one of the new leaders, but he hasn't demonstrated his skills in battle just yet. And we haven't seen his Keyblade, for that matter! And does Ephemer really state that Ven is a Master? Huh, I don't remember that. But anyways, this would be pretty ironic if Ventus regains his memory of his past in Kingdom Hearts III, and then he's like: "Gosh, I was Master before Aqua and Terra!" That'd be something! Also, like other members have stated, Ava was the one that chose Ventus, not the Master Of Masters. He only told Ava to choose who would be fit, but that doesn't mean he was involved in the choosing of said candidates, ya know? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elfdemon_ 695 Posted January 7, 2018 The Dandelion Union Leaders aren't Keyblade Masters like the Foretellers were as far as we know. They're "Masters" of the Dandelion Unions, but they're not Keyblade Masters. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hoshiko Hikari 300 Posted January 14, 2018 Ava chose the new union leaders did she not? Not the MoM. Or did MoM manipulate it someway? I'm pretty sure Ava did pick them. We clearly saw Ava give strelitzia one of the books that she was giving to all the new Union leaders. Four of them are dandelions that were hand-picked by Ava, not the MoM. MoM simply gave Ava the order the pick a group of Keyblade Wielders that would go on to survive passed the Keyblade War. MoM did not specify what people she should've chosen. She picked the people who she saw fit. Well, Ventus is definitely one of the new leaders, but he hasn't demonstrated his skills in battle just yet. And we haven't seen his Keyblade, for that matter! And does Ephemer really state that Ven is a Master? Huh, I don't remember that. But anyways, this would be pretty ironic if Ventus regains his memory of his past in Kingdom Hearts III, and then he's like: "Gosh, I was Master before Aqua and Terra!" That'd be something! Also, like other members have stated, Ava was the one that chose Ventus, not the Master Of Masters. He only told Ava to choose who would be fit, but that doesn't mean he was involved in the choosing of said candidates, ya know? Watch the cutscene "Union Leaders" again. Ava chose most of the Dandelions herself but it was the Master of Masters who chose the new union leaders. He gave Ava a piece of paper with five names written on it and said, "They're your new recruits. Make them all Dandelions, and when the time comes, teach them their roles." One of those names had a red circle around it which Ava queried and was told that that person would get their own copy of the Book of Prophecies. Therefore, although it was Ava who told each of the new leaders that they had been chosen, she didn't choose them herself. The Dandelion Union Leaders aren't Keyblade Masters like the Foretellers were as far as we know. They're "Masters" of the Dandelion Unions, but they're not Keyblade Masters. True it hasn't been specified what kind of Masters they are so you might be right. Well, Ventus is definitely one of the new leaders, but he hasn't demonstrated his skills in battle just yet. And we haven't seen his Keyblade, for that matter! And does Ephemer really state that Ven is a Master? Huh, I don't remember that. But anyways, this would be pretty ironic if Ventus regains his memory of his past in Kingdom Hearts III, and then he's like: "Gosh, I was Master before Aqua and Terra!" That'd be something! Also, like other members have stated, Ava was the one that chose Ventus, not the Master Of Masters. He only told Ava to choose who would be fit, but that doesn't mean he was involved in the choosing of said candidates, ya know? Ephemer didn't specifically say that Ven was a Master but he did say that he himself was one. When Ava first tells him about his new role (in the cutscene entitled Number Four) he says, "Me? A Master? A Union Leader?" So if he is a Master then the other union leaders are probably Masters too. 1 The Transcendent Key reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Transcendent Key 12,109 Posted January 15, 2018 Watch the cutscene "Union Leaders" again. Ava chose most of the Dandelions herself but it was the Master of Masters who chose the new union leaders. He gave Ava a piece of paper with five names written on it and said, "They're your new recruits. Make them all Dandelions, and when the time comes, teach them their roles." One of those names had a red circle around it which Ava queried and was told that that person would get their own copy of the Book of Prophecies. Therefore, although it was Ava who told each of the new leaders that they had been chosen, she didn't choose them herself. Ephemer didn't specifically say that Ven was a Master but he did say that he himself was one. When Ava first tells him about his new role (in the cutscene entitled Number Four) he says, "Me? A Master? A Union Leader?" So if he is a Master then the other union leaders are probably Masters too. Ooh, you're right! Well, that's just made things all the more intriguing! Makes me wonder what the Master Of Masters had in mind for these select people? Given that he chose them, he must have some hidden machinations at play! Hmm, you make a fair point. Right then, so Ven is a Keyblade Master alongside the other new union leaders! 1 Hoshiko Hikari reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hoshiko Hikari 300 Posted January 15, 2018 Ooh, you're right! Well, that's just made things all the more intriguing! Makes me wonder what the Master Of Masters had in mind for these select people? Given that he chose them, he must have some hidden machinations at play! Hmm, you make a fair point. Right then, so Ven is a Keyblade Master alongside the other new union leaders! My thoughts exactly. I can't help thinking *spoiler warning for the latest NA story update* that he chose Strelitzier to be a union leader simply to use her as live bait. Even her Chirithy questioned her being made a union leader! I mean she was adorable but she really didn't seem to be leadership material as she was so shy. And surely the Master would have foreseen what would happen to her? Seems rather suspicious to me. 1 The Transcendent Key reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ventus_ 396 Posted January 16, 2018 Ava chose the new union leaders did she not? Not the MoM. Or did MoM manipulate it someway? I'm pretty sure Ava did pick them. We clearly saw Ava give strelitzia one of the books that she was giving to all the new Union leaders. Four of them are dandelions that were hand-picked by Ava, not the MoM. MoM simply gave Ava the order the pick a group of Keyblade Wielders that would go on to survive passed the Keyblade War. MoM did not specify what people she should've chosen. She picked the people who she saw fit. Ava was only the recruiter, she summoned the new leaders from a list compiled by the MoM. In the scene which introduces Ven, we see the MoM giving her the list and her having to inquire as to a single name circled in red, the name of the one leader who will receive a copy of the BoP. ~~~~~~ There, however, is no allusion to the criteria that produced the chosen and so no solid evidence that Ven is or was a Keyblade master. We still don't even know how he came to be in the BBS timeline much less with no memory. And we haven't seen his Keyblade, for that matter! Haven't we? Both Roxas and Data Roxas wield it in KHII and 2.5 but that one is not the Wayward Wind from BBS so it stands to reason it's Ven's original Keyblade. 1 The Transcendent Key reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Transcendent Key 12,109 Posted January 16, 2018 My thoughts exactly. I can't help thinking *spoiler warning for the latest NA story update* that he chose Strelitzier to be a union leader simply to use her as live bait. Even her Chirithy questioned her being made a union leader! I mean she was adorable but she really didn't seem to be leadership material as she was so shy. And surely the Master would have foreseen what would happen to her? Seems rather suspicious to me. And as happens in the wonderful world of Kingdom Hearts, not everything is as it seems, and when it comes to the Master Of Masters and his plans, all the more so! I can't wait to see what new developments come to the surface! Haven't we? Both Roxas and Data Roxas wield it in KHII and 2.5 but that one is not the Wayward Wind from BBS so it stands to reason it's Ven's original Keyblade. Wait, you mean Oblivion? Because other than the Kingdom Key and Oathekeeper, Roxas hasn't wielded any other Keyblade. Would Oblivion really be Ven's true Keyblade? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ventus_ 396 Posted January 16, 2018 Wait, you mean Oblivion? Because other than the Kingdom Key and Oathekeeper, Roxas hasn't wielded any other Keyblade. Would Oblivion really be Ven's true Keyblade? I mean in the Axel and Data Roxas battles when he double wields. That second Keyblade is Ven's. Isn't it? 1 The Transcendent Key reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Transcendent Key 12,109 Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) I mean in the Axel and Data Roxas battles when he double wields. That second Keyblade is Ven's. Isn't it? Well, we know for a fact that the Kingdom Key is Sora's, and Oathkeeper was given to Sora when Kairi gave him her good luck charm, so for Oblivion, I really don't know...I mean, it appeared to Roxas after Xion died, so I think that Oblivion was formed after her death to symbolize her fate of oblivion, of being forgotten by all those who knew her. So no, I don't think that Oblivion is Ventus's true Keyblade. Though before that, Oblivion appeared in a Treasure Chest in Hollow Bastion in Kingdom Hearts I, so I honestly don't know! Edited January 16, 2018 by The Transcendent Key Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
