Final Fantasy XV was never really in development for 10 years

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Before I start I wanna clarify to some bullies around here who sees the title of this thread and make some stupid wild assumption:No I'm not a hater,I actually like FFXV.Okay now that's out of the way............

 

A big misconception that's been going around is that because Versus XIII was announced ten years ago way back in 2006 that means the actual development cycle of the game was truly a decade.

 

At first I used to think that's the case too until I learned more and more about the development process that goes into that type of games and the conclusion is:No,not even close to ten years(Gee,Square Enix announcing games too early?That never happened befoooooooooooore )

 

 

Sure it was announced 10 years ago but the actual workload for the game didn't even start until late 2012 to 2013.Not even the 2011 trailer shown at the 1st Production Department Premeire convention that Square held was real especially with how vastly different it looked compared to the 2013 and onward trailers

 

What we saw from 2006 all the way up to 2011 was more or less just CG proof of concept trailers with no tangible showcase of what the plot was supposed to be and the 2011 footage wasn't even from a playable built as we never saw those footage being demoed at any point on an actual Ps3 back when the game was announced for it.

 

In short,what Nomura and the previous team working on the game did between 2006 and 2011 was a complete and utter unpresentable mess that Square,for the longest time,had no idea how to showcase\reveal to the public in a presentable fashion as quite frankly,little to nothing was written for the story beyond designs by Roberto Ferrari for characters like Ardyn who was designed back in 2010 and wouldn't appear until the 2013 rereveal of the game being reworked into FFXV(with the exception of Aranea who did appear in the 2011 trailer with no reveal to her identity or role besides that she's a female dragoon and that's it).

 

 

 

The supposed fanboys of Versus XIII(really how can something that never even existed\materialized had it's own fanbase is beyond me) claim that Tabata supposedly "Ruined Nomura's vision for Versus XIII) and demand a quote unquote "remake for Versus" which baffles the mind to no end.

 

For the past decade or so Nomura was directing not one,not two,not three,not four,but FIVE DIFFERENT KINGDOM HEARTS GAMES:358\2 Days,Birth by Sleep,Coded\Recoded,Dream Drop Distance and Chi\Unchained X.You can't possibly tell me that him working on this never detracted from his work on Versus XIII especially when different staff members were constantly being pulled from it into other projects(without mentioning the people who left Square Enix during that) especially when it was revealed later on that he's also working on KH3 which was revealed in 2013.Not to mention two Dissidia games,The World Ends with You and some other small projects

 

Which brings me to the answer that's more or less obvious by now.But the actual real dev time for Final Fantasy XV was three years which was exactly the period Tabata took over the project as a director.

 

Hajime Tabata never ruined whatever "vision" Nomura had for the game when said vision never materialized to something worth a damn to begin with(At one point in 2013 he meant for the game to be  A FREAKIN MUSICAL). The reason why the game felt rushed and a lot of content was cut out of the final product was because,simply put,the three year development cycle was simply not enough.Throughout the years we've seen constant changes to the gameplay as everything from the 2013 trailer was more or less either gone or changed to something completely different heck even what we played in episode Duscae was completely changed.

 

The state Nomura left the project in was simply put:Hell incarnate.The three year period was just not enough yet Tabata and his new team persevered to put out the game on such a strict time limit because any further delay for the game after the September delay would kill all the hype the game built and would pretty much ruin whatever plan they had for the 30th anniversary in 2017 and FF16.

 

Aside from the general concept and maybe the designs of the pre-2010 cast,Nomura's vision for XV\Versus XIII barely if ever existed so for people to just randomly shit on Hajime Tabata for little to no reason is just preposterous.He did all he can to save this game from being an unpresentable shitfest and there was no way the final product wouldn't suffer from the huge cuts it endured with such a limiting,restrictive development time

 

If anything I personally blame Nomura more than anyone else for what XV suffered and I blame Square Enix in general for never learning their lesson with their bloated and anti-dev stupid Luminous Engine and Crystal Tools Engine that were nightmares to develop for.Sure they produced very visually impressive graphics but everything else from gameplay to story from 2007 onward suffered.That and I also blaming Square for never having a clear idea what to do with Nomura as a director.Never giving the chance for other producers and directors to try and be in charge and instead assigning the same guy to buttload of projects all at once leading to some of them to suffer severely in cost of finishing others.And not to mention their infamous practice of announcing games waaaay too early before they even make an alpha build for any of them

[The 13th Kenpachi 4,279]

Before I start I wanna clarify to some bullies around here who sees the title of this thread and make some stupid wild assumption:No I'm not a hater,I actually like FFXV.Okay now that's out of the way............

 

A big misconception that's been going around is that because Versus XIII was announced ten years ago way back in 2006 that means the actual development cycle of the game was truly a decade.

 

At first I used to think that's the case too until I learned more and more about the development process that goes into that type of games and the conclusion is:No,not even close to ten years(Gee,Square Enix announcing games too early?That never happened befoooooooooooore )

 

 

Sure it was announced 10 years ago but the actual workload for the game didn't even start until late 2012 to 2013.Not even the 2011 trailer shown at the 1st Production Department Premeire convention that Square held was real especially with how vastly different it looked compared to the 2013 and onward trailers

 

What we saw from 2006 all the way up to 2011 was more or less just CG proof of concept trailers with no tangible showcase of what the plot was supposed to be and the 2011 footage wasn't even from a playable built as we never saw those footage being demoed at any point on an actual Ps3 back when the game was announced for it.

 

In short,what Nomura and the previous team working on the game did between 2006 and 2011 was a complete and utter unpresentable mess that Square,for the longest time,had no idea how to showcase\reveal to the public in a presentable fashion as quite frankly,little to nothing was written for the story beyond designs by Roberto Ferrari for characters like Ardyn who was designed back in 2010 and wouldn't appear until the 2013 rereveal of the game being reworked into FFXV(with the exception of Aranea who did appear in the 2011 trailer with no reveal to her identity or role besides that she's a female dragoon and that's it).

 

 

The supposed fanboys of Versus XIII(really how can something that never even existed\materialized had it's own fanbase is beyond me) claim that Tabata supposedly "Ruined Nomura's vision for Versus XIII) and demand a quote unquote "remake for Versus" which baffles the mind to no end.

 

For the past decade or so Nomura was directing not one,not two,not three,not four,but FIVE DIFFERENT KINGDOM HEARTS GAMES:358\2 Days,Birth by Sleep,Coded\Recoded,Dream Drop Distance and Chi\Unchained X.You can't possibly tell me that him working on this never detracted from his work on Versus XIII especially when different staff members were constantly being pulled from it into other projects(without mentioning the people who left Square Enix during that) especially when it was revealed later on that he's also working on KH3 which was revealed in 2013.Not to mention two Dissidia games,The World Ends with You and some other small projects

 

Which brings me to the answer that's more or less obvious by now.But the actual real dev time for Final Fantasy XV was three years which was exactly the period Tabata took over the project as a director.

 

Hajime Tabata never ruined whatever "vision" Nomura had for the game when said vision never materialized to something worth a damn to begin with(At one point in 2013 he meant for the game to be  A FREAKIN MUSICAL). The reason why the game felt rushed and a lot of content was cut out of the final product was because,simply put,the three year development cycle was simply not enough.Throughout the years we've seen constant changes to the gameplay as everything from the 2013 trailer was more or less either gone or changed to something completely different heck even what we played in episode Duscae was completely changed.

 

The state Nomura left the project in was simply put:Hell incarnate.The three year period was just not enough yet Tabata and his new team persevered to put out the game on such a strict time limit because any further delay for the game after the September delay would kill all the hype the game built and would pretty much ruin whatever plan they had for the 30th anniversary in 2017 and FF16.

 

Aside from the general concept and maybe the designs of the pre-2010 cast,Nomura's vision for XV\Versus XIII barely if ever existed so for people to just randomly shit on Hajime Tabata for little to no reason is just preposterous.He did all he can to save this game from being an unpresentable shitfest and there was no way the final product wouldn't suffer from the huge cuts it endured with such a limiting,restrictive development time

 

If anything I personally blame Nomura more than anyone else for what XV suffered and I blame Square Enix in general for never learning their lesson with their bloated and anti-dev stupid Luminous Engine and Crystal Tools Engine that were nightmares to develop for.Sure they produced very visually impressive graphics but everything else from gameplay to story from 2007 onward suffered.That and I also blaming Square for never having a clear idea what to do with Nomura as a director.Never giving the chance for other producers and directors to try and be in charge and instead assigning the same guy to buttload of projects all at once leading to some of them to suffer severely in cost of finishing others.And not to mention their infamous practice of announcing games waaaay too early before they even make an alpha build for any of them

 

 

 

What are you talking about? Dean defended Tabata in the video he made...

 

I don't think it's fair to bash Nomura and say it was all his fault. It was a mixture of different factors. Anyone who says this game was in development for more than 3 years has some research to do or is plain lying.

 

 

Anyway, I honestly don't care about this whole fiasco anymore. It's boring to talk about, I just want to see the FF7 remake and know if Hiroyuki Ito is making FF16.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

What are you talking about? Dean defended Tabata in the video he made...

 

I don't think it's fair to bash Nomura and say it was all his fault. It was a mixture of different factors. Anyone who says this game was in development for more than 3 years has some research to do or is plain lying.

 

 

Anyway, I honestly don't care about this whole fiasco anymore. It's boring to talk about, I just want to see the FF7 remake and know if Hiroyuki Ito is making FF16.

Gah a little error,I meant to put another name but his popped in my head by mistake

 

As for Nomura,I only said a big part of the blame not all of it

 

It's an overall big huge problem with modern day Square's philosophy of game development

Edited January 8, 2017 by Smash Mega Koopa

[The 13th Kenpachi 4,279]

Gah a little error,I meant to put another name but his popped in my head by mistake

 

As for Nomura,I only said a big part of the blame not all of it

If anything, wasn't it the KH fanbase's fault since they were the ones who kept demanding games? That's more of a suggestion rather than a statement so I don't want fanboys to start attacking me.

 

The Luminous Engine is trash and should be slam dunked into the garbage bin. Wow, it makes the game look pretty! Despite causing both KH3 and FF15 to have development problems. FF13 looks better than FF15 and that was made on a weaker engine.

 

Square Enix have learned from that anyway, FF7R is using UE4, they switched KH3 to UE4 and FF16 will probably do the same.

Edited January 8, 2017 by The 13th Kenpachi

[Dio Brando 5,810]

If anything, wasn't it the KH fanbase's fault since they were the ones who kept demanding games? That's more of a suggestion rather than a statement so I don't want fanboys to start attacking me.

 

The Luminous Engine is trash and should be slam dunked into the garbage bin. Wow, it makes the game look pretty! Despite causing both KH3 and FF15 to have development problems. FF13 looks better than FF15 and that was made on a weaker engine.

 

Square Enix have learned from that anyway, FF7R is using UE4, they switched KH3 to UE4 and FF16 will probably do the same.

It's a mixture of both to be honest

 

Nomura planned for BBS to be a thing ever since 2005 with that hidden teaser that you can unlock when beating vanilla KH2 on Proud Mode(no not the one in Final Mix) and shortly after the three pre DDD handheld games were announced 2 years later so the mess that would eventually happen would've occured regardless

 

It's not strictly because of fan demand,but because KH1 and 2 were hot sellers that they made the handheld games in the first place.Had they made KH3 and released it first the handheld games would've never sold as much as they did

 

Although,fan demand or not,Nomura clearly and obviously would care about the franchise he created more than the creation of others and would put the effort into his own baby moreso than some spin-off(at the time) they one day assigned him to direct 

Edited January 8, 2017 by Smash Mega Koopa

[KHLegendIII 709]

Before I start I wanna clarify to some bullies around here who sees the title of this thread and make some stupid wild assumption:No I'm not a hater,I actually like FFXV.Okay now that's out of the way............

 

A big misconception that's been going around is that because Versus XIII was announced ten years ago way back in 2006 that means the actual development cycle of the game was truly a decade.

 

At first I used to think that's the case too until I learned more and more about the development process that goes into that type of games and the conclusion is:No,not even close to ten years(Gee,Square Enix announcing games too early?That never happened befoooooooooooore )

 

 

Sure it was announced 10 years ago but the actual workload for the game didn't even start until late 2012 to 2013.Not even the 2011 trailer shown at the 1st Production Department Premeire convention that Square held was real especially with how vastly different it looked compared to the 2013 and onward trailers

 

What we saw from 2006 all the way up to 2011 was more or less just CG proof of concept trailers with no tangible showcase of what the plot was supposed to be and the 2011 footage wasn't even from a playable built as we never saw those footage being demoed at any point on an actual Ps3 back when the game was announced for it.

 

In short,what Nomura and the previous team working on the game did between 2006 and 2011 was a complete and utter unpresentable mess that Square,for the longest time,had no idea how to showcase\reveal to the public in a presentable fashion as quite frankly,little to nothing was written for the story beyond designs by Roberto Ferrari for characters like Ardyn who was designed back in 2010 and wouldn't appear until the 2013 rereveal of the game being reworked into FFXV(with the exception of Aranea who did appear in the 2011 trailer with no reveal to her identity or role besides that she's a female dragoon and that's it).

 

 

 

The supposed fanboys of Versus XIII(really how can something that never even existed\materialized had it's own fanbase is beyond me) claim that Tabata supposedly "Ruined Nomura's vision for Versus XIII) and demand a quote unquote "remake for Versus" which baffles the mind to no end.

 

For the past decade or so Nomura was directing not one,not two,not three,not four,but FIVE DIFFERENT KINGDOM HEARTS GAMES:358\2 Days,Birth by Sleep,Coded\Recoded,Dream Drop Distance and Chi\Unchained X.You can't possibly tell me that him working on this never detracted from his work on Versus XIII especially when different staff members were constantly being pulled from it into other projects(without mentioning the people who left Square Enix during that) especially when it was revealed later on that he's also working on KH3 which was revealed in 2013.Not to mention two Dissidia games,The World Ends with You and some other small projects

 

Which brings me to the answer that's more or less obvious by now.But the actual real dev time for Final Fantasy XV was three years which was exactly the period Tabata took over the project as a director.

 

Hajime Tabata never ruined whatever "vision" Nomura had for the game when said vision never materialized to something worth a damn to begin with(At one point in 2013 he meant for the game to be  A FREAKIN MUSICAL). The reason why the game felt rushed and a lot of content was cut out of the final product was because,simply put,the three year development cycle was simply not enough.Throughout the years we've seen constant changes to the gameplay as everything from the 2013 trailer was more or less either gone or changed to something completely different heck even what we played in episode Duscae was completely changed.

 

The state Nomura left the project in was simply put:Hell incarnate.The three year period was just not enough yet Tabata and his new team persevered to put out the game on such a strict time limit because any further delay for the game after the September delay would kill all the hype the game built and would pretty much ruin whatever plan they had for the 30th anniversary in 2017 and FF16.

 

Aside from the general concept and maybe the designs of the pre-2010 cast,Nomura's vision for XV\Versus XIII barely if ever existed so for people to just randomly shit on Hajime Tabata for little to no reason is just preposterous.He did all he can to save this game from being an unpresentable shitfest and there was no way the final product wouldn't suffer from the huge cuts it endured with such a limiting,restrictive development time

 

If anything I personally blame Nomura more than anyone else for what XV suffered and I blame Square Enix in general for never learning their lesson with their bloated and anti-dev stupid Luminous Engine and Crystal Tools Engine that were nightmares to develop for.Sure they produced very visually impressive graphics but everything else from gameplay to story from 2007 onward suffered.That and I also blaming Square for never having a clear idea what to do with Nomura as a director.Never giving the chance for other producers and directors to try and be in charge and instead assigning the same guy to buttload of projects all at once leading to some of them to suffer severely in cost of finishing others.And not to mention their infamous practice of announcing games waaaay too early before they even make an alpha build for any of them

 

 

 

 

I agree, while the game was okay, there were lot's of things missing, as some recent leaks have claimed such as another form for Ardyn, and a bigger version of the area with the Shiva statue, including Cor from the second half, all because of an alleged contract that they had to release it last yea rno matter what. They had no choice, and ended up leaving a lot out of the final game, but the game is fine for me, it just needed more work, like fleshing out the story, adding full exploration on Nifilheim lands such as Cartonica, especially recently, people found out you could glitch out of the train station to explore it, and there were roads that were added to it, they weren't there in 1.02, they were in the 1.03 update. I would've liked to explore Nifilheim's lands. Thankfully Tabata is adding more story content through updates. But overall, I don't blame Tabata for it, three years just wasn't enough.

[Clouded Sun 1,232]

Oh my god, basically almost everything I wanted to say for years.

 

I will say one thing; Nomura was tasked with a lotta shit over the years from being character designer for almost every character after FFIX to having all those KH games (which, in essence, might be his fault. He knew FF Versus XIII was the only thing keeping him back from finishing KH3). Even so, he kept a grip on a project he knew he couldn't handle. SE had a lot bouncing around this man, unfortunately, and whenever Vs. XIII would disappear, Nomura took the L. In actuality, a lot about how XV ended up was thanks to the marketing, sales, and business team of SE.

 

Either way you think about it, it is undeniable that Tabata got a freaking shitstorm of a game in 2014. The game was designed to be a trilogy, which was alright in 2006 after SE bathed in the effect and praise for FFX's and KH's sequels. After XIII, SE was definitely going to get one hell of a flame war if XV even thought of becoming any more than a single game. 2013 wasn't even a year in development — that year, everything was being ported from Ebony to Luminous. Not only that, but the business department said that the game HAS TO BE OUT BY THE END OF 2016, no buts. With Episode Duscae's release, people loathed the battle system, so that was entirely revamped. Combat was obviously more of a focus than story, and although the combat system is probably one of the most genius and fun I've ever played in an action game, the story is what makes FF.

 

Disregarding the fact that the game was entirely too short, it looks like they were able to get almost everything, with the exception of certain parts of Altissia in the first half of the game was completed, and crafted well. An additional two to three more bases story wise would have enhanced the "threat" of Niflheim (where the hell was that daemon scene from Brotherhood?!), but overall the first half left me satisfied. The second half had major pacing issues, info dumps, and a reveal that had absolutely no effect to the story whatsoever. It. Was. A. Mess. Tabata knew this before September, he knew the game was bugged, he KNEW that the story was all over the place. The bugs weren't bad. The story was. Scenes were cut because of fear of feminazis, the Gods were totally cut, and everything was just... Bleh. The feeling was there every second. The fear, the brotherhood, the tension — the feeling was still there. That's what FFXV nailed every moment of the game. The story wasn't great.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Clouded Sun

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Oh my god, basically almost everything I wanted to say for years.

 

I will say one thing; Nomura was tasked with a lotta shit over the years from being character designer for almost every character after FFIX to having all those KH games (which, in essence, might be his fault. He knew FF Versus XIII was the only thing keeping him back from finishing KH3). Even so, he kept a grip on a project he knew he couldn't handle. SE had a lot bouncing around this man, unfortunately, and whenever Vs. XIII would disappear, Nomura took the L. In actuality, a lot about how XV ended up was thanks to the marketing, sales, and business team of SE.

 

Either way you think about it, it is undeniable that Tabata got a freaking shitstorm of a game in 2014. The game was designed to be a trilogy, which was alright in 2006 after SE bathed in the effect and praise for FFX's and KH's sequels. After XIII, SE was definitely going to get one hell of a flame war if XV even thought of becoming any more than a single game. 2013 wasn't even a year in development — that year, everything was being ported from Ebony to Luminous. Not only that, but the business department said that the game HAS TO BE OUT BY THE END OF 2016, no buts. With Episode Duscae's release, people loathed the battle system, so that was entirely revamped. Combat was obviously more of a focus than story, and although the combat system is probably one of the most genius and fun I've ever played in an action game, the story is what makes FF.

 

Disregarding the fact that the game was entirely too short, it looks like they were able to get almost everything, with the exception of certain parts of Altissia in the first half of the game was completed, and crafted well. An additional two to three more bases story wise would have enhanced the "threat" of Niflheim (where the hell was that daemon scene from Brotherhood?!), but overall the first half left me satisfied. The second half had major pacing issues, info dumps, and a reveal that had absolutely no effect to the story whatsoever. It. Was. A. Mess. Tabata knew this before September, he knew the game was bugged, he KNEW that the story was all over the place. The bugs weren't bad. The story was. Scenes were cut because of fear of feminazis, the Gods were totally cut, and everything was just... Bleh. The feeling was there every second. The fear, the brotherhood, the tension — the feeling was still there. That's what FFXV nailed every moment of the game. The story wasn't great.

Yeah.

 

I mean sure overall I like the game but it could've been so much more and sadly the story,the most crucial part of a FF game,suffered greatly because of it

 

I mean it's not a bad story but it's a wholly unfinished one that if it wasn't for Noct's crew and Ardyn I might've ended up hating it

[KHLegendIII 709]

This pretty much sums up part of the recent leak I just mentioned, although there's a chance for it to be false, but if it's true I wouldn't be surprised that it was cut due to time constraints or story re-writes.:

 

http://creditconcerto.blogspot.com/2016/12/the-journey-from-versus-to-xv-tale-of.html

[Dio Brando 5,810]

This pretty much sums up part of the recent leak I just mentioned, although there's a chance for it to be false, but if it's true I wouldn't be surprised that it was cut due to time constraints or story re-writes.:

 

http://creditconcerto.blogspot.com/2016/12/the-journey-from-versus-to-xv-tale-of.html

Oh another thing

 

Remember the "alleged hoax" on Kotaku that Versus XIII was canceled?

 

I honestly think this has legitimately happened behind the scenes at some point before they reworked it into XV but because of the backlash they claimed it didn't

[KHLegendIII 709]

Oh another thing

 

Remember the "alleged hoax" on Kotaku that Versus XIII was canceled?

 

I honestly think this has legitimately happened behind the scenes at some point before they reworked it into XV but because of the backlash they claimed it didn't

 

I remember that day when that happened. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case, in some ways I can understand, but the other ways it would be questionable to an extent.

Edited January 8, 2017 by KHLegendIII

[Dio Brando 5,810]

I remember that day when that happened. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case, in some ways I can understand, but the other ways it would be questionable to an extent.

Keep in mind though that at the time Square was losing an enormous amount of money after the failure of the original 1.0 release of FFXIV and  the troubled development of Versus XIII was another nail on the coffin so they needed to cut the losses from one place or another so it makes sense Versus would get the axe at the time before the salvaged whatever remained of it's corpse to make XV with

[Kingdomhe 1,362]

If anything, wasn't it the KH fanbase's fault since they were the ones who kept demanding games? That's more of a suggestion rather than a statement so I don't want fanboys to start attacking me.

The Luminous Engine is trash and should be slam dunked into the garbage bin. Wow, it makes the game look pretty! Despite causing both KH3 and FF15 to have development problems. FF13 looks better than FF15 and that was made on a weaker engine.

Square Enix have learned from that anyway, FF7R is using UE4, they switched KH3 to UE4 and FF16 will probably do the same.

  

It's a mixture of both to be honest

 

Nomura planned for BBS to be a thing ever since 2005 with that hidden teaser that you can unlock when beating vanilla KH2 on Proud Mode(no not the one in Final Mix) and shortly after the three pre DDD handheld games were announced 2 years later so the mess that would eventually happen would've occured regardless

 

It's not strictly because of fan demand,but because KH1 and 2 were hot sellers that they made the handheld games in the first place.Had they made KH3 and released it first the handheld games would've never sold as much as they did

 

Although,fan demand or not,Nomura clearly and obviously would care about the franchise he created more than the creation of others and would put the effort into his own baby moreso than some spin-off(at the time) they one day assigned him to direct

 

No because apparently what all the fans want is KH FREAKING 3 AND NOW NOW NOOOOOW!!!!!

Sorry, lost my cool there for a sec.

 

Anyway, I don't really care about ffxv anymore, it's kind of old news now. Whether it's 10 years or 3, the way they handled it was bad, the fact that you need to watch a movie, anime, and play an app game before you understand the story or start to care about the charactars isn't good (and don't get me started on this DLC crap they are pulling). The gameplay is great from what I've heard, seen, and played but something still rubs me the wrong way about it for some reason but I can't place my finger on it. while it has been in dev for 3 years it still was announced 10 years ago, so it's still a 10 year game as far as I'm concern, SE should stop announcing things soooooooooo early. Bottomline, even though I like the game (because I did watch the movie and all that stuff minus the app game before looking at the game), I don't want this to happen to kh3.

[KHLegendIII 709]

Keep in mind though that at the time Square was losing an enormous amount of money after the failure of the original 1.0 release of FFXIV and  the troubled development of Versus XIII was another nail on the coffin so they needed to cut the losses from one place or another so it makes sense Versus would get the axe at the time before the salvaged whatever remained of it's corpse to make XV with

 

Yeah, it would seem like they had no choice but to cancel it, bu tat least they salvaged the game to re-purpose it to as we know today. Some things from the game remained the same, such as a the recent leak claimed that Gralea was taken from the old game, or at least it's concepts, and put into FFXV, and it was always going to have it filled with Daemons, although the leaker did say that there were concept art of how the city looked without the Daemons, but they won't be shown as he claimed. I wouldn't be surprised if the leak was true, but I'm taking it with a grain of salt, but it makes sense. The game could have been better, but we've got what we got, at least it's getting updates.

Edited January 8, 2017 by KHLegendIII

[Clouded Sun 1,232]

 

Anyone else think Luna and the Astrals became pointless in the end?

When you think about it, Noct went on this whole quest to take out the Empire with the power of the Astrals. Luna had to sacrifice herself to call them and all. But story-wise, Shiva, Ifrit, and Titan play absolutely no part in the story but the decimation of Altissia. And for what reason? Maybe they were going to be used in the cut part of Ardyn's final form (or form before Noctis and Ardyn fell to the ground and started whaling on each other).

 

[Dio Brando 5,810]

 

Anyone else think Luna and the Astrals became pointless in the end?

 

When you think about it, Noct went on this whole quest to take out the Empire with the power of the Astrals. Luna had to sacrifice herself to call them and all. But story-wise, Shiva, Ifrit, and Titan play absolutely no part in the story but the decimation of Altissia. And for what reason? Maybe they were going to be used in the cut part of Ardyn's final form (or form before Noctis and Ardyn fell to the ground and started whaling on each other).

 

Well the Astrals I can come up with some justifications,but the Nox Flurett siblings oh no they're the biggest disappointment of the game Especially Ravus

 

Luna had little to no personality aside from being female Jesus and lots of what supposed to flesh out her character was cut but at least she had some screen time

 

Ravus on the other hand..........none of what he does in the whole story(including Kingsglaive) make any sense and I can count the few scenes he appeared in on one hand before his boss battle 

  

No because apparently what all the fans want is KH FREAKING 3 AND NOW NOW NOOOOOW!!!!!

Sorry, lost my cool there for a sec.

 

Anyway, I don't really care about ffxv anymore, it's kind of old news now. Whether it's 10 years or 3, the way they handled it was bad, the fact that you need to watch a movie, anime, and play an app game before you understand the story or start to care about the charactars isn't good (and don't get me started on this DLC crap they are pulling). The gameplay is great from what I've heard, seen, and played but something still rubs me the wrong way about it for some reason but I can't place my finger on it. while it has been in dev for 3 years it still was announced 10 years ago, so it's still a 10 year game as far as I'm concern, SE should stop announcing things soooooooooo early. Bottomline, even though I like the game (because I did watch the movie and all that stuff minus the app game before looking at the game), I don't want this to happen to kh3.

I'm more concerned about the FFVII remake

 

The fact that Nomura direct both it and KH3 means he'll obviously put more care into KH3 which would lead the VII remake to suffer the same fate as XV

[KHLegendIII 709]

Speaking of Nifilheim lands, here's a video by someone who played the game and managed to do a glitch in Cartonica, the area beneath the train station should've been explorable, including the area that looked like the African Savannah.:

 

 

[Clouded Sun 1,232]

 

I'm more concerned about the FFVII remake

 

The fact that Nomura direct both it and KH3 means he'll obviously put more care into KH3 which would lead the VII remake to suffer the same fate as XV

This is literally the same stuff I've been saying for years. If he did it to FFXV, there's no way he could handle the pressure of FFVII:R and KH3 at the same time. It's either gonna make one suffer or delay one again. And guess which one would be the victim?

[Dio Brando 5,810]

This is literally the same stuff I've been saying for years. If he did it to FFXV, there's no way he could handle the pressure of FFVII:R and KH3 at the same time. It's either gonna make one suffer or delay one again. And guess which one would be the victim?

I might as well prepare myself to cherish my memories with the original FFVII as I'm sure it's gonna suffer

 

Don't get me wrong.I want KH3 to be as great and amazing as it can be,but charging the same director with two projects,one of which might quite possibly be the most anticipated game from the company in the last decade,is not a good decision especially when it proved time and again that this will have it's ginormous negatives on other projects

[KHUndertaleFan25 2,858]

I never knew that. That's freaking crazy despite not being a big fan of Final Fantasy.

[PrinceNoctis 1,011]

Before I start I wanna clarify to some bullies around here who sees the title of this thread and make some stupid wild assumption:No I'm not a hater,I actually like FFXV.Okay now that's out of the way............

 

A big misconception that's been going around is that because Versus XIII was announced ten years ago way back in 2006 that means the actual development cycle of the game was truly a decade.

 

At first I used to think that's the case too until I learned more and more about the development process that goes into that type of games and the conclusion is:No,not even close to ten years(Gee,Square Enix announcing games too early?That never happened befoooooooooooore )

 

 

Sure it was announced 10 years ago but the actual workload for the game didn't even start until late 2012 to 2013.Not even the 2011 trailer shown at the 1st Production Department Premeire convention that Square held was real especially with how vastly different it looked compared to the 2013 and onward trailers

 

What we saw from 2006 all the way up to 2011 was more or less just CG proof of concept trailers with no tangible showcase of what the plot was supposed to be and the 2011 footage wasn't even from a playable built as we never saw those footage being demoed at any point on an actual Ps3 back when the game was announced for it.

 

In short,what Nomura and the previous team working on the game did between 2006 and 2011 was a complete and utter unpresentable mess that Square,for the longest time,had no idea how to showcase\reveal to the public in a presentable fashion as quite frankly,little to nothing was written for the story beyond designs by Roberto Ferrari for characters like Ardyn who was designed back in 2010 and wouldn't appear until the 2013 rereveal of the game being reworked into FFXV(with the exception of Aranea who did appear in the 2011 trailer with no reveal to her identity or role besides that she's a female dragoon and that's it).

 

 

 

The supposed fanboys of Versus XIII(really how can something that never even existed\materialized had it's own fanbase is beyond me) claim that Tabata supposedly "Ruined Nomura's vision for Versus XIII) and demand a quote unquote "remake for Versus" which baffles the mind to no end.

 

For the past decade or so Nomura was directing not one,not two,not three,not four,but FIVE DIFFERENT KINGDOM HEARTS GAMES:358\2 Days,Birth by Sleep,Coded\Recoded,Dream Drop Distance and Chi\Unchained X.You can't possibly tell me that him working on this never detracted from his work on Versus XIII especially when different staff members were constantly being pulled from it into other projects(without mentioning the people who left Square Enix during that) especially when it was revealed later on that he's also working on KH3 which was revealed in 2013.Not to mention two Dissidia games,The World Ends with You and some other small projects

 

Which brings me to the answer that's more or less obvious by now.But the actual real dev time for Final Fantasy XV was three years which was exactly the period Tabata took over the project as a director.

 

Hajime Tabata never ruined whatever "vision" Nomura had for the game when said vision never materialized to something worth a damn to begin with(At one point in 2013 he meant for the game to be  A FREAKIN MUSICAL). The reason why the game felt rushed and a lot of content was cut out of the final product was because,simply put,the three year development cycle was simply not enough.Throughout the years we've seen constant changes to the gameplay as everything from the 2013 trailer was more or less either gone or changed to something completely different heck even what we played in episode Duscae was completely changed.

 

The state Nomura left the project in was simply put:Hell incarnate.The three year period was just not enough yet Tabata and his new team persevered to put out the game on such a strict time limit because any further delay for the game after the September delay would kill all the hype the game built and would pretty much ruin whatever plan they had for the 30th anniversary in 2017 and FF16.

 

Aside from the general concept and maybe the designs of the pre-2010 cast,Nomura's vision for XV\Versus XIII barely if ever existed so for people to just randomly shit on Hajime Tabata for little to no reason is just preposterous.He did all he can to save this game from being an unpresentable shitfest and there was no way the final product wouldn't suffer from the huge cuts it endured with such a limiting,restrictive development time

 

If anything I personally blame Nomura more than anyone else for what XV suffered and I blame Square Enix in general for never learning their lesson with their bloated and anti-dev stupid Luminous Engine and Crystal Tools Engine that were nightmares to develop for.Sure they produced very visually impressive graphics but everything else from gameplay to story from 2007 onward suffered.That and I also blaming Square for never having a clear idea what to do with Nomura as a director.Never giving the chance for other producers and directors to try and be in charge and instead assigning the same guy to buttload of projects all at once leading to some of them to suffer severely in cost of finishing others.And not to mention their infamous practice of announcing games waaaay too early before they even make an alpha build for any of them

Okay, I disagree...

First of all, it is not true that there was no development made from 2006 to 2011. Development for Versus XIII started around 2008, it was then halted because the team had to help out with FFXIII. Once the team was done helping, they continued the development for Versus XIII, by 2011 they had enough to showcase actual in-game footage (so the gameplay was real) and not only concept CG trailers like before. By the end of that year, they'd finished 25% of the game. In 2012, Square decided that the project had grown big enough to become a main series entry and the name of the product was changed to FFXV. Originally, the story for XV was supposed to be exactly the same as Versus XIII and although there have been major changes in the story, the essence of Versus XIII remains to this day in the game (if you analyze the elements of the story carefully, you'll see that the basis of the story is almost the same as the Fabula Nova Crystallis with different terminology). So Nomura, in 2012, had a clear vision for the game and a full story that he planned to tell across a series of multiple games that he would call "World of the Versus Epic" which later became the "Final Fantasy XV Universe". In 2012, probably towards the end of the year, Tabata joined the project and they had to start everything from scratch. So that's when the development for the XV we know today started. The trailer shown in 2013 was directed by Nomura, but Tabata was already changing the game back then. Anyway, it is not true that Versus XIII never materialized, it is not true that it had no story and it is not true that all of this is Nomura's fault. Square kept pulled the team from the Versus project so they lost a full year of development and just when Versus was starting to get its groove on, the company decided to put it on next-gen consoles. Now I understand that Nomura had a role to play in all of this too, he and Nojima were rewriting the story for Versus (roughly every 3 months according to Ferrari) and he took on way too many projects, but you can't blame him entirely for the long period of development. You also can't act like Tabata is a god who cleaned up Nomura's mess. Tabata repeated some of Nomura's mistakes and made other mistakes. First of all, he did promises that he wasn't able to keep and he hyped the game so much that many ended up disappointed. That's not a big problem though. But he also made mistakes on a narrative level, as of june 2016, they were still rewriting stuff. That's how it was during the whole development cycle. Rewriting the story all the time (proven by the inconsistencies within the XV universe). So yeah, XV's development wasn't just a case of Nomura being disorganized and slacking off. It's a lot of people's fault: Square's, Nojima's, Nomura's, Tabata's, the writer who replaced Nojima...

 

This is literally the same stuff I've been saying for years. If he did it to FFXV, there's no way he could handle the pressure of FFVII:R and KH3 at the same time. It's either gonna make one suffer or delay one again. And guess which one would be the victim?

You guys do realize that Nomura worked on 14 projects from 2006 to 2013! It's one of the reasons Versus XIII took so much time. You really think he can't handle directing 2 projects at the same time with the help of co-directors? Come on, now. There is no need for concern. And to everyone saying XV's story is bad...I have to disagree again. It is poorly executed and incomplete for sure, but it's a great story. As many people put it, XV is an incomplete masterpiece. 

Edited January 8, 2017 by PrinceNoctis

[KingdomHearts3 2,591]

It was FFVSXIII for a while, then they had to start from scratch. It kind of evolved, but as for ten years of development straight, I guess you could say that FFXV hasn't been in development for a decade when they stopped VSXIII and started from scratch come XV. I still think that period was transition and it still was in development for a decade; it just evolved during that time.

[Dio Brando 5,810]

Okay, I disagree...

First of all, it is not true that there was no development made from 2006 to 2011. Development for Versus XIII started around 2008, it was then halted because the team had to help out with FFXIII. Once the team was done helping, they continued the development for Versus XIII, by 2011 they had enough to showcase actual in-game footage (so the gameplay was real) and not only concept CG trailers like before. By the end of that year, they'd finished 25% of the game. In 2012, Square decided that the project had grown big enough to become a main series entry and the name of the product was changed to FFXV. Originally, the story for XV was supposed to be exactly the same as Versus XIII and although there have been major changes in the story, the essence of Versus XIII remains to this day in the game (if you analyze the elements of the story carefully, you'll see that the basis of the story is almost the same as the Fabula Nova Crystallis with different terminology). So Nomura, in 2012, had a clear vision for the game and a full story that he planned to tell across a series of multiple games that he would call "World of the Versus Epic" which later became the "Final Fantasy XV Universe". In 2012, probably towards the end of the year, Tabata joined the project and they had to start everything from scratch. So that's when the development for the XV we know today started. The trailer shown in 2013 was directed by Nomura, but Tabata was already changing the game back then. Anyway, it is not true that Versus XIII never materialized, it is not true that it had no story and it is not true that all of this is Nomura's fault. Square kept pulled the team from the Versus project so they lost a full year of development and just when Versus was starting to get its groove on, the company decided to put it on next-gen consoles. Now I understand that Nomura had a role to play in all of this too, he and Nojima were rewriting the story for Versus (roughly every 3 months according to Ferrari) and he took on way too many projects, but you can't blame him entirely for the long period of development. You also can't act like Tabata is a god who cleaned up Nomura's mess. Tabata repeated some of Nomura's mistakes and made other mistakes. First of all, he did promises that he wasn't able to keep and he hyped the game so much that many ended up disappointed. That's not a big problem though. But he also made mistakes on a narrative level, as of june 2016, they were still rewriting stuff. That's how it was during the whole development cycle. Rewriting the story all the time (proven by the inconsistencies within the XV universe). So yeah, XV's development wasn't just a case of Nomura being disorganized and slacking off. It's a lot of people's fault: Square's, Nojima's, Nomura's, Tabata's, the writer who replaced Nojima...

 

You guys do realize that Nomura worked on 14 projects from 2006 to 2013! It's one of the reasons Versus XIII took so much time. You really think he can't handle directing 2 projects at the same time with the help of co-directors? Come on, now. There is no need for concern. And to everyone saying the XV's story is bad...I have to disagree again. It is poorly executed and incomplete for sure, but it's a great story. As many people put it, XV is an incomplete masterpiece. 

When and where did I say XV's story is bad?

 

Also I'm sorry but I'm not the type of guy who'll blindly overlook someone's shortcomings and praise every single thing they do as a magnamopis of excellency as if all Nomura's works are so perfec they're uncriticizable

 

I'm not gonna go back to my blind fanboy status again but I'm not a hater either

 

I never acted like Tabata is a god cuz one of his works,Type-0,is boring as hell in my opinion

 

I never said Nomura is the only one to blame but he shares a big part of it.

 

I have every right to be concerned cuz why I love XV it clearly could've been something much better had Nomura wasn't in charge with a dozen projects cuz obviously he'll care about his child KH than something he didn't create himself

 

Which is why I feel VII remake will suffer the same fate heck knowing Nomura we probably won't see the last episodic release until maybe 2027

 

If you don't agree with me,that's fine I respect that but don't tell me how to think and feel with stuff like you're not allowed to say this or that I should think something is a masterpiece or not

[Kingdomhe 1,362]

Well the Astrals I can come up with some justifications,but the Nox Flurett siblings oh no they're the biggest disappointment of the game Especially Ravus

 

Luna had little to no personality aside from being female Jesus and lots of what supposed to flesh out her character was cut but at least she had some screen time

 

Ravus on the other hand..........none of what he does in the whole story(including Kingsglaive) make any sense and I can count the few scenes he appeared in on one hand before his boss battle

I'm more concerned about the FFVII remake

 

The fact that Nomura direct both it and KH3 means he'll obviously put more care into KH3 which would lead the VII remake to suffer the same fate as XV

True, but didn't they get a co-director for it? That might help.

Okay, I disagree...

First of all, it is not true that there was no development made from 2006 to 2011. Development for Versus XIII started around 2008, it was then halted because the team had to help out with FFXIII. Once the team was done helping, they continued the development for Versus XIII, by 2011 they had enough to showcase actual in-game footage (so the gameplay was real) and not only concept CG trailers like before. By the end of that year, they'd finished 25% of the game. In 2012, Square decided that the project had grown big enough to become a main series entry and the name of the product was changed to FFXV. Originally, the story for XV was supposed to be exactly the same as Versus XIII and although there have been major changes in the story, the essence of Versus XIII remains to this day in the game (if you analyze the elements of the story carefully, you'll see that the basis of the story is almost the same as the Fabula Nova Crystallis with different terminology). So Nomura, in 2012, had a clear vision for the game and a full story that he planned to tell across a series of multiple games that he would call "World of the Versus Epic" which later became the "Final Fantasy XV Universe". In 2012, probably towards the end of the year, Tabata joined the project and they had to start everything from scratch. So that's when the development for the XV we know today started. The trailer shown in 2013 was directed by Nomura, but Tabata was already changing the game back then. Anyway, it is not true that Versus XIII never materialized, it is not true that it had no story and it is not true that all of this is Nomura's fault. Square kept pulled the team from the Versus project so they lost a full year of development and just when Versus was starting to get its groove on, the company decided to put it on next-gen consoles. Now I understand that Nomura had a role to play in all of this too, he and Nojima were rewriting the story for Versus (roughly every 3 months according to Ferrari) and he took on way too many projects, but you can't blame him entirely for the long period of development. You also can't act like Tabata is a god who cleaned up Nomura's mess. Tabata repeated some of Nomura's mistakes and made other mistakes. First of all, he did promises that he wasn't able to keep and he hyped the game so much that many ended up disappointed. That's not a big problem though. But he also made mistakes on a narrative level, as of june 2016, they were still rewriting stuff. That's how it was during the whole development cycle. Rewriting the story all the time (proven by the inconsistencies within the XV universe). So yeah, XV's development wasn't just a case of Nomura being disorganized and slacking off. It's a lot of people's fault: Square's, Nojima's, Nomura's, Tabata's, the writer who replaced Nojima...

 

 

You guys do realize that Nomura worked on 14 projects from 2006 to 2013! It's one of the reasons Versus XIII took so much time. You really think he can't handle directing 2 projects at the same time with the help of co-directors? Come on, now. There is no need for concern. And to everyone saying the XV's story is bad...I have to disagree again. It is poorly executed and incomplete for sure, but it's a great story. As many people put it, XV is an incomplete masterpiece.

 

The story was good, but it definitely wasn't a masterpiece. Edited January 8, 2017 by Kingdomhe

[PrinceNoctis 1,011]

When and firetrucking where did I say XV's story is bad huh?

 

Also I'm sorry but I'm not the type of guy who'll blindly overlook someone's shortcomings and praise every single thing they do as a magnamopis of excellency as if all Nomura's works are so perfec they're uncriticizable

 

I'm not gonna go back to my blind fanboy status again but I'm not a hater either

 

I never acted like Tabata is a god cuz one of his works,Type-0,is boring as hell in my opinion

 

I never said Nomura is the only one to blame but he shares a big part of it.

 

I have every right to be concerned cuz why I love XV it clearly could've been something much better had Nomura wasn't in charge with a dozen projects cuz obviously he'll care about his child KH than something he didn't create himself

 

Which is why I feel VII remake will suffer the same fate heck knowing Nomura we probably won't see the last episodic release until maybe 2027

 

If you don't agree with me,that's fine I respect that but don't tell me how to think and feel with stuff like you're not allowed to say this or that I should think something is a masterpiece or not

I wrote "to everyone saying the story for XV was bad", if you didn't say it, then you're not concerned. And I was only sharing my opinion on that matter, you don't have to agree. If someone feels the story was bad, then who am I to say they're wrong? I'm not telling you how to feel about the story or about the game, I was telling you what I thought of it and I also never said XV was a masterpiece or that everyone should think it's a masterpiece. I meant to say that XV had the potential to be a masterpiece, but it wasn't. As of FFVII Remake, some people such as Ferrari are already working on other episodes so I'm guessing development is just fine for the game and Nomura caring about what he creates more than the rest of his projects has, in my opinion, nothing to do with what he focuses on. He created the world of XV, the base concept for the story and the characters and he still didn't give it the time it needed. Meanwhile, he was designing characters for FFXIII, which he did not create. Anyway, I did not mean to offend you in any kind of way. Sorry if I did.

 

True, but didn't they get a co-director for it? That might help.

The story was good, but it definitely wasn't a masterpiece.

Once again, I never said the story was a masterpiece. I said the story was great but poorly executed. I also said that the game (meaning gameplay, story, open world and everything) combined formed an "incomplete masterpiece". Meaning the game had the potential to be a masterpiece, but it wasn't because of time restraints, troubled development, etc. 

 

I don't mean to cause any trouble guys, just sharing my opinion. Please don't misinterpret my intentions.

Edited January 8, 2017 by PrinceNoctis