Dream Drop Distance Time Travel

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

So we all know the rules for time travel in Dream Drop Distance: you have to give up your body. you can only go to times that you already exist in, yadda yadda yadda. But how exactly does the time traveling itself happen? Does Young Xehanort just will a portal to the time stream into existence? Does he summon a door like the ones from Kingdom Hearts 2? Do the Xehanorts fly around in an evil TARDIS? This game would be so much better if they actually showed things happening on screen.

[!4misettie 350]

In my experience playing though the kh series as a whole the story is a confusing one.

 

Things in the story make no sense sometimes, things get retconned the list goes on.

[animemylove 439]

i think you're looking too far into it .. the main issue I have is still how it works and what he's doing. he can only bring xemnas and ansem into the dark and sleeping realm right? or did they only show up because sora was in the past? 

[The 13th Kenpachi 4,279]

Chrono Trigger came out in 1995 and the entire plot was centred around time travel, yet it still makes a million times more sense than the way they've done it here.

 

I honestly have no clue, he probably just summons a portal and hops through. But I won't put it past them to over complicate it, if we ever see it happening on screen.

[Master Eraqus 1,340]

I think they just fade away. We've seen that happen at the end of DDD, after Sora was saved.

[Sorarocks93 678]

I think it's just teleportation through time. Since you'd need another version of you somewhere where you'd be going. It's just your heart going from one point to the next.

[keystrike 145]

Headcanon: Time magic and dreams are tightly interwoven. Why? The rules for time travel (must have a version of yourself at the destination, must leave your body behind, you can only go backwards, and you cannot change events destined to happen) are precisely what you would expect with dream time travel (you can only dream to events of your past, you don't physically go into dreams, you can only dream real events of the past, and of course what you do in your dreams can't affect what actually happened). How are the two concepts interwoven? I don't know. There are a number of times in DDD when Sora or Riku explains how visiting the dream world is like going back in time (e.g. Pranksters Paradise, beginning of Riku's story and end of Sora's story). There are also instances of time travel (Sora and Riku back on destiny islands) that one would doubtlessly identify as a dream if it were not for some stupid convoluted plot points about Sora and Riku having to reset their experience to learn to wield the keyblade the right way.

 

If I had to bet they are going to expand on this in Back Cover to connect the book of prophecies up with the datascape (note: The Grid, a digital world, is in the realm of dreams) and the realm of dreams (recall chirithy is a dreameater). I wouldn't count on it making any more sense then, but I'm betting it continues along the same themes.

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

In my experience playing though the kh series as a whole the story is a confusing one.

 

Things in the story make no sense sometimes, things get retconned the list goes on.

While I agree that it's convoluted and disagree on which things are retcons, the previous games at least gave us something to work with unlike DDD which gave us either optional flashbacks with no transitions at all to just everything else off screen.

 

i think you're looking too far into it .. the main issue I have is still how it works and what he's doing. he can only bring xemnas and ansem into the dark and sleeping realm right? or did they only show up because sora was in the past? 

That's another thing, it's implied that Sora and Riku go back in time to the destruction of Destiny Islands to get to the Sleeping Realm but once they're there, they're apparently shunted back into the present because everything at the end of the game, from The World That Never Was still being intact and in the present day real world to Micky, Donald, Goofy, and Lea appearing there without any trouble, would make no sense.

 

I think they just fade away. We've seen that happen at the end of DDD, after Sora was saved.

Yes they faded away but we only see that at the end. By the time the game actually gets underway, the time travelling is done, the Seekers are already all in the present. We could have at least seen something in Young Xehanort's flashback to when he first met his future self's Heartless.

 

Headcanon: Time magic and dreams are tightly interwoven. Why? The rules for time travel (must have a version of yourself at the destination, must leave your body behind, you can only go backwards, and you cannot change events destined to happen) are precisely what you would expect with dream time travel (you can only dream to events of your past, you don't physically go into dreams, you can only dream real events of the past, and of course what you do in your dreams can't affect what actually happened). How are the two concepts interwoven? I don't know. There are a number of times in DDD when Sora or Riku explains how visiting the dream world is like going back in time (e.g. Pranksters Paradise, beginning of Riku's story and end of Sora's story). There are also instances of time travel (Sora and Riku back on destiny islands) that one would doubtlessly identify as a dream if it were not for some stupid convoluted plot points about Sora and Riku having to reset their experience to learn to wield the keyblade the right way.

 

If I had to bet they are going to expand on this in Back Cover to connect the book of prophecies up with the datascape (note: The Grid, a digital world, is in the realm of dreams) and the realm of dreams (recall chirithy is a dreameater). I wouldn't count on it making any more sense then, but I'm betting it continues along the same themes.

This. This makes so much more sense than anything in the entire game.

[The Transcendent Key 12,109]

You know what? I'm just gonna wrap it all up to Nomura logic!

 

But in all seriousness though, keystrike's explanation is pretty darn good! It's a pretty good explanation into how the whole time travel thing works, ya know?

 

And something that came into my mind is that Ansem, when he was at his weakest, was the one who approached Young Xehanort and taught him how to time travel, am I right? So Ansem, at some point in time, must have acquired this skill, in one way or another! I know this doesn't help much, but it's just something that came from the top of my mind!

[animemylove 439]

I love DDD but .. I just can't grasp the full plot of that game lol

[Master Eraqus 1,340]

Yes they faded away but we only see that at the end. By the time the game actually gets underway, the time travelling is done, the Seekers are already all in the present. We could have at least seen something in Young Xehanort's flashback to when he first met his future self's Heartless.

No, I'm saying that I think when somebody time travels, they just fade away like the Seekers of Darkness did at the end of DDD. For example, when Young Xehanort time travels and leaves Destiny Islands to the future, he would just fade away.

 

Either way, does it really matter on knowing how time travelling works, outside of curiosity?

Edited January 7, 2017 by Master Eraqus

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

No, I'm saying that I think when somebody time travels, they just fade away like the Seekers of Darkness did at the end of DDD. For example, when Young Xehanort time travels and leaves Destiny Islands to the future, he would just fade away.

 

Either way, does it really matter on knowing how time travelling works, outside of curiosity?

For me it does. I'm the kind of guy who enjoys obsessively going over every itty bitty detail for explanations of how things work in fiction as proven by just about every post I make here. This is why it pisses me off when things don't get explained or happen off screen. For example, how did Sora and Riku get to Destiny Islands at the beginning of DDD and somehow become a year younger? Never explained AND happens off screen. 2.8 and 3 better give us some kind of answers.

[Master Eraqus 1,340]

For me it does. I'm the kind of guy who enjoys obsessively going over every itty bitty detail for explanations of how things work in fiction as proven by just about every post I make here. This is why it pisses me off when things don't get explained or happen off screen. For example, how did Sora and Riku get to Destiny Islands at the beginning of DDD and somehow become a year younger? Never explained AND happens off screen. 2.8 and 3 better give us some kind of answers.

The reason they ended up in Destiny Islands was because Yen Sid had sent them back in time before Destiny Islands was swallowed by the darkness, as stated in this cutscene:

 

 

The reason they're younger is because, as Young Xehanort stated, you must leave your body behind in order to move through time. That's what Sora and Riku did and went into their younger bodies. It's like X-Men Days of Future Past if you watched that movie.

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

The reason they ended up in Destiny Islands was because Yen Sid had sent them back in time before Destiny Islands was swallowed by the darkness, as stated in this cutscene:

 

 

The reason they're younger is because, as Young Xehanort stated, you must leave your body behind in order to move through time. That's what Sora and Riku did and went into their younger bodies. It's like X-Men Days of Future Past if you watched that movie.

I must have the faultiest memory ever. Fair point about Yen Sid explicitly saying that he would send them back but I do not recall it ever being stated that they explicitly left their bodies behind and took up temporary residence in their past selves. And just as I say that you're most likely going to pull up a cutscene explaining exactly that. But if that truly is the case, then how did Sora and Riku end up jumping forward to the present day with their past bodies after they entered the Sleeping Realm? Otherwise Mickey, Donald, Goofy, Lea, and the apparently genuinely reborn Master Xehanort appearing at the end in the Castle makes no damn sense.

[Master Eraqus 1,340]

I must have the faultiest memory ever. Fair point about Yen Sid explicitly saying that he would send them back but I do not recall it ever being stated that they explicitly left their bodies behind and took up temporary residence in their past selves. And just as I say that you're most likely going to pull up a cutscene explaining exactly that.

 

I appreciate the confidence, but unfortunately... no. I am not entirely certain about the whole body thing as I remember being told that by someone here on KH13 quite a while ago and I'm not sure who. (Hoping it was Harlea Quinn...)

 

However, I might help with this quote from the Post Game Famitsu Interview:

 

When both of them are in the reality parts, they don’t return to their original bodies. Why is that?

It’s because of Yen Sid’s magic that they’ve taken their old forms. If they didn’t return to Yen Sid’s place, their bodies wouldn’t return back to normal. Incidentally, their new outfits were thanks to Yen Sid’s magic as Sora suspected.

 

So the reason they look younger is because of Yen Sid's magic. Whether they possessed their past selves' bodies or not, I'm not sure, but I am certain someone told me on this site, but unfortunately forgot who. So, my apologies if I got that one wrong.

 

But if that truly is the case, then how did Sora and Riku end up jumping forward to the present day with their past bodies after they entered the Sleeping Realm? Otherwise Mickey, Donald, Goofy, Lea, and the apparently genuinely reborn Master Xehanort appearing at the end in the Castle makes no damn sense.

They ended up to the present day because when Sora entered The World That Never Was, he was no longer in the Realm of Sleep and thus, in the real world. According to Xigbar, they led Sora there. At 0:46 here:

 

Edited January 8, 2017 by Master Eraqus

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

However, I might help with this quote from the Post Game Famitsu Interview:

 

 

So the reason they look younger is because of Yen Sid's magic. Whether they possessed their past selves' bodies or not, I'm not sure, but I am certain someone told me on this site, but unfortunately forgot who. So, my apologies if I got that one wrong.

 

They ended up to the present day because when Sora entered The World That Never Was, he was no longer in the Realm of Sleep and thus, in the real world. According to Xigbar, they led Sora there. At 0:46 here:

 

But why would Yen Sid de-age them? What purpose did that serve? Well, aside from the animators wanting to use the old models one last time before the grand finale.

 

I completely remember Xigbar's explanation, in fact that entire ending is the only part of the game that I remember clearly. My question is how and why: Sora and Riku were sent back one year and yet they're pushed forward again almost instantly? According to Young Xehanort, Ansem could only go back once and then had to wait out the timeline on Destiny Islands till the beginning of KH1 so why did Sora and Riku instantly go forward? By this logic they should have come out at The World That Never Was one year in the past, not the current version that somehow survived being torn apart by a giant robot dragon. Did Yen Sid put them under a delayed suspended animation spell that would only wear off once a year had passed? And for that matter, shouldn't they have faded away to their original time and forgotten everything like the Seekers did? Already the supposedly strict rules of time travel are broken to pieces.

Edited January 8, 2017 by KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio

[Master Eraqus 1,340]

But why would Yen Sid de-age them? What purpose did that serve? Well, aside from the animators wanting to use the old models one last time before the grand finale.

My best guess would be that it would help indicate when the Mark of Mastery Exam would be over, i.e. they would know it would be over when they returned to normal. And they would turn back to their original selves after returning to the Mysterious Tower:

 

In the latter half of The World That Never Was, despite returning to the real world, why do Sora and Riku stay in their younger forms, and why do Dream Eaters appear etc?

Sora and Riku’s form is due to Yen Sid’s magic, so the way it works is that they can’t turn back until they return to the Mysterious Tower...

 

 

I completely remember Xigbar's explanation, in fact that entire ending is the only part of the game that I remember clearly. My question is how and why: Sora and Riku were sent back one year and yet they're pushed forward again almost instantly? According to Young Xehanort, Ansem could only go back once and then had to wait out the timeline on Destiny Islands till the beginning of KH1 so why did Sora and Riku instantly go forward? By this logic they should have come out at The World That Never Was one year in the past, not the current version that somehow survived being torn apart by a giant robot dragon. Did Yen Sid put them under a delayed suspended animation spell that would only wear off once a year had passed? And for that matter, shouldn't they have faded away to their original time and forgotten everything like the Seekers did? Already the supposedly strict rules of time travel are broken to pieces.

Since Young Xehanort had gained to power to travel through time thanks to Ansem SOD, he may have led Sora, and thus Riku since he was in Sora's dreams, to that point in time and leaving the Realm of Sleep.

 

As for why, it was the point in time when Xehanort was recompleted after Ansem SOD and Xemnas had been felled by Sora. Master Xehanort in DDD is referred to as the "most future self" and was part of the Seekers of Darkness. So, it was that point in time where they wished to gather the 13 Seekers of Darkness, with Sora as the 13th.

 

You got me there on the memory loss for Sora and Riku, but for the time limit, they didn't fade away since they did return to their original time.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Master Eraqus

[KeybladeMasterDeadpoolio 55]

Since Young Xehanort had gained to power to travel through time thanks to Ansem SOD, he may have led Sora, and thus Riku since he was in Sora's dreams, to that point in time and leaving the Realm of Sleep.

 

As for why, it was the point in time when Xehanort was recompleted after Ansem SOD and Xemnas had been felled by Sora. Master Xehanort in DDD is referred to as the "most future self" and was part of the Seekers of Darkness. So, it was that point in time where they wished to gather the 13 Seekers of Darkness, with Sora as the 13th.

 

You got me there on the memory loss for Sora and Riku, but for the time limit, they didn't fade away since they did return to their original time.

That just raises further questions about how powerful Master Xehanort truly is if he's able to choose where and when his physical being is reborn.

 

I think I have a solution to the memory thing: when Ansem went back to meet his younger self, he didn't immediately fade back and lose his memory but stayed and waited out the sixty odd years on Destiny Islands. It's only when the future version of Ansem, the one possessing Riku's body, is sent to the future that the memory loss happens. Sora and Riku only went into the past and only followed the natural progression of time to the present day while the Seekers all traveled to a future that existed beyond where their existences ceased to be (Young Xehanort eventually has to grow up into his older selves, Ansem, Xemnas, Xigbar, and Saix all being dead, etc.). So it's only going to the future that causes the amnesia, not going to the past.