74 replies to this topic

[Emo/Yami]

The friendzone idea is... stupid. Even though I've used it myself to describe how some people operate, its only out of habit. If you ask a girl out and she rejects you, yet goes out with someone "worse" than you, their are many possible reasons;

1) She knows the person is acting the way they do for a reason and they might not be as "bad" as they seem. This was the case between my first girlfriend and I; she told me that she first rejected me because of my angry outbursts, nonchalant attitude, and tendency to be violent but after talking to my friends, she decided to go out with me instead of another friend (at the time he was an acquaintance).

2) You could be worse than you think. People usually don't see the negative sides of their personalities as negative, instead only looking at the positive side of the negative aspect.

3) She's simply not interested, You know its possible. That "douchebag" might be more interesting than you.

4) She could be a "fix-it" kind of girl; meaning that she doesn't want to give up on someone until there desirable.

5) She could be clingy and/ or you're obsessive.

Can't think of anything else right now.

[Koko]

If you can find /legitimate proof/, not just opinions, that the term is sexist, then I will back down. Until then, I will keep defending everyone who has used the term, both guys /and/ girls,from your childish, accusatory actions.

Guys are not perfect, girls aren't perfect either. Not all guys want sex, and not all girls are innocent and timid. Some girls even have the decency to come on a public forum and accuse most of the male population of being sexist for using a phrase that both sexes share. The phrase itself is not sexist. Its the /intent/ behind it that gives it definition.

You see something, and claim that its wrong. Then you go places and spout off and think your actions are just. Then someone like me comes along with actual common logic and an open mind and tries to get you to see that you, yourself are wrong. Girls who use it are just clingy, while guys who use it are downright disgusting sexist pigs? That's the /intent/ I am seeing with your posts and to me, thats just wrong.

Okay, first of all, this has nothing to do with facts, but with the opinions one or many holds. If you have the opinion that women are below you, that is sexist. That is not a fact, that is an opinion. If you have the opinion that black people are below you, that is racist. Racism and sexism and ableism has to do with privileged and that privileged gives people distorted opinions.

Never did I say all guys were jerks or all girls were innocent. People are people and people are flawed but that does not mean they can not be educated.

Never did I accuse the whole male population that they were sexist, but I did indeed say that the term is sexist because of the connotation behind it that will never be rid of, no matter how hard you try.

You are misinterpreting my words and are getting offended over nothing. You are not using common logic, you're just upset at well, the truth.
And I never said that girls who use it were clinging.
Here listen to me closely
What I said was

If girls befriend a guy in order to pursue a relationship, they are clingy.
Guys are never seen this way.
Ever.
If girls friendzones a guy, she's a bitch.
If a guy friendzones a girl, she's clingy.
It's a lose-lose for females either way.

The point that you are missing is that the term is sexist due to the connotation behind it, and there's no denying that. Just because everyone uses it doesn't make it right. It's like saying you're going to defend people who use racist terms because EVERYONE uses it, so that makes it okay, right? No. That's not how it works.

Also, it seems I need to quote this again because you're not getting it.

Was all our time together really wasted because there was no hypothetical pay off?
Guys who do this and claim to be “nice guys” are the worst misogynists because of their sense of entitlement toward a woman. They make investments in property and expect their dividends. They are fake friends. They are selfish. And they will jump at the chance to vilify you and victimize themselves when their attempts at manipulation don’t work. Clearly, “friendzone” is the remnant of a phenomenon that has plagued women since the beginning of time: women are not independent creatures. Our love lives exist only in the context of a man’s desire. When we make independent decisions, we are subject to a host of derogatory terms. “Slut” is how we vilify a woman for exercising her right to say “yes”. “Friendzone” is how we vilify a woman for exercising her right to say “no”

Accusing a girl of friendzoning is the same as calling her a slut. So unless you support slut shaming and victim blaming, I don't see why you're trying to prove that the friendzone isn't sexist.

I'm not aiming this at anyone, except to those guilty of being those misogynistic assholes. If you are not under that category, then all I ask is that you don't firetrucking use the term and move on.

[DragonMaster]

I don't believe I said this was referring to all guys
It's unfair to lump all guys together
But sadly, a majority of guys are this way.

To claim that something is a majority, one must have proof, otherwise it is a generalization. No matter what your personal experience, that isn't a way to indicate real data. In my experience, most girls just don't try in Phys Ed class. Does that mean I can claim a majority of girls are lazy and do nothing during their gym class? No, and something tells me that you would disagree with that, being both a female and one who isn't lazy (if your status updates about working out are anything to go by). Generalizations are a form of ignorance from which discrimination grows. Perhaps replace "majority" with "some" or "many" or "a fair amount", as that would not only be more fair, but also be less hypocritical.

No offense, as I am sure that you meant nothing by it, and I'm not trying to start an argument. Just was a bit... ticked off, I suppose, on how this topic is all for equal treatment and no discrimination (which I am all for) but containing a statement that was rather opposite that purpose.

[Koko]

To claim that something is a majority, one must have proof, otherwise it is a generalization. No matter what your personal experience, that isn't a way to indicate real data. In my experience, most girls just don't try in Phys Ed class. Does that mean I can claim a majority of girls are lazy and do nothing during their gym class? No, and something tells me that you would disagree with that, being both a female and one who isn't lazy (if your status updates about working out are anything to go by). Generalizations are a form of ignorance from which discrimination grows. Perhaps replace "majority" with "some" or "many" or "a fair amount", as that would not only be more fair, but also be less hypocritical.

No offense, as I am sure that you meant nothing by it, and I'm not trying to start an argument. Just was a bit... ticked off, I suppose, on how this topic is all for equal treatment and no discrimination (which I am all for) but containing a statement that was rather opposite that purpose.

I'm sorry, I didn't intend it that way! Sometimes my thinking process is a little to fast for my hands so when I type things out, they don't always come out the way I mean it.
But I agree with you, thanks for pointing it out to me (:

[Madotsuki]

''it's her choice in the end and it's no one's business except hers''

I'm sorry but if a girl willingly choose to date an asshole instead a guy who truly cares for her then she's not very bright.And no the guy she chooses to date is not an asshole just because he was chosen over the friendzoned guy.I talking about a legit jerk who mistreats her.

or maybe she just (spoiler warning!!) doesn't have feelings for the other guy.


@OP: this whole concept is pretty much how I got into my last relationship. one of my close friends had had a crush on me for a while, and kept buying me expensive things even when I said no, and kept playing the "I'm just a nice guy why do all of the girls i like date asshole le sobbu" card. and when I broke up with him, some of our mutual friends even acted like I somehow did something wrong, and that I was a horrible person for not having feelings for him.

[Emo/Yami]

or maybe she just (spoiler warning!!) doesn't have feelings for the other guy. http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/orig...


@OP: this whole concept is pretty much how I got into my last relationship. one of my close friends had had a crush on me for a while, and kept buying me expensive things even when I said no, and kept playing the "I'm just a nice guy why do all of the girls i like date asshole le sobbu" card. and when I broke up with him, some of our mutual friends even acted like I somehow did something wrong, and that I was a horrible person for not having feelings for him.

Man, you just spoiled Guilt Tripping for me!

On a more serious note: That entire situation there is very common in my school

[baylaust]

So I've been looking at this thread for about 15 minutes, seeing valid points for both sides, and some points I don't agree with on both sides. I've determined that if I post a longer explaination of these points and my full opinion, it will be impossible to avoid offending somebody, so I'll just say this:

When the phrase "friendzone" is used, everybody loses.

Edited by baylaust, 07 April 2012 - 02:26 AM.

[legendkiller222]

This is always a generalization that guys who are rejected hate girls who friendzone them. Girls say "oh they hate women", no they probably just hate YOU because you handled it terribly. A girl can friendzone a guy and it can go well or terribly depending on how the girl tells the guy or what she lets happen before she tells him how she feels. If a girl leads the guy on and he is then rejected he will feel hurt. Sometimes the guy takes it the wrong way, but its hard to not feel like hating that person at the moment you hear that you basically aren't good enough for them. Usually nice guys get the short end of the stick because they aren't as aggressive as douches are and end up just being the shoulder to cry on when things go bad. Girls are the same exact way when being rejected by guys. They talk sh*t on guys that reject them just like guys do the same about the girls that reject them.

[Madotsuki]

Sometimes the guy takes it the wrong way, but its hard to not feel like hating that person at the moment you hear that you basically aren't good enough for them.

no. you don't get it.
a girl not liking you =/= you not being "good enough" for her. there is nothing wrong with her just because she doesn't have feelings for you.
get your self-centered head out of your ass.

[RobertOrri]

I was in what you would call a friendzone, I told her I liked her, she didn't like me back.

Am I mad at her? Do I blame her? The answer is NO, and why should I?

It's not her fault she doesn't like me.

[legendkiller222]

no. you don't get it.
a girl not liking you =/= you not being "good enough" for her. there is nothing wrong with her just because she doesn't have feelings for you.
get your self-centered head out of your ass.

I never said there is anything wrong with a girl who chooses not to like someone, I'm just stating the truth. If a girl doesn't like a guy or a guy doesn't like a girl or guy doesn't like another guy or girl doesn't like another girl it means that they think that person isn't good enough for them. There is no way to argue that. It's put in nicer terms, but its the truth. If you like someone it means you want them and if they don't want you it is because they don't view you as good enough for them or "right" for them which is saying you don't have qualities they want, it still means you aren't good enough for them in their eyes. That can be hurtful for anyone. I can see why a guy would act hateful. It's natural to be upset and angry after being rejected by anyone for anything. When someone is revealing feelings for you it depends on how you react and that sets the whole thing in motion. Sometimes a girl can handle it well and still the guy gets mad, but its fine to and they have a right to because they are being told that they do not have what that person wants which is in other words being told they aren't good enough for them.

This is all on an individual level and needs to stop being distorted into a whole attack on women because it truly isn't. There are people who just handle being rejected not so well and that is fine and there are people that handle telling the person who likes them that they don't harbor the same feelings not so well.

[Koko]

I never said there is anything wrong with a girl who chooses not to like someone, I'm just stating the truth. If a girl doesn't like a guy or a guy doesn't like a girl or guy doesn't like another guy or girl doesn't like another girl it means that they think that person isn't good enough for them. There is no way to argue that. It's put in nicer terms, but its the truth. If you like someone it means you want them and if they don't want you it is because they don't view you as good enough for them or "right" for them which is saying you don't have qualities they want, it still means you aren't good enough for them in their eyes. That can be hurtful for anyone. I can see why a guy would act hateful. It's natural to be upset and angry after being rejected by anyone for anything. When someone is revealing feelings for you it depends on how you react and that sets the whole thing in motion. Sometimes a girl can handle it well and still the guy gets mad, but its fine to and they have a right to because they are being told that they do not have what that person wants which is in other words being told they aren't good enough for them.

This is all on an individual level and needs to stop being distorted into a whole attack on women because it truly isn't. There are people who just handle being rejected not so well and that is fine and there are people that handle telling the person who likes them that they don't harbor the same feelings not so well.

you are missing the point lmao
it's not how it's handled because a girl can handle it perfectly fine while the guy is the one getting mad for no reason
or a girl can handle it like shit and the guy gets mad
either way
no matter how a girl handles it
if the guy gets pissed off, it's her fault, whether the guy is being rational or not
that is why it's sexist
and it has nothing to do with if the guy is good enough for the girl or not
like madotsuki said, stop being self centered
it's not about the guy all the time
and this is how your taking it
saying that being friendzoned is like being told you're not good enough for them is extremely self centered and you arent even acknowledging why the girl rejected you
you're automatically assuming you're not good enough
and you know how some people take that?
they take it as the girl being a snobby bitch who thinks she's better than anyone
now i said some, not all
but it's true
NO MATTER HOW YOU SEE IT
IF A GIRL FRIENDZONES A GUY, IT'S HER FAULT TO THE OUTSIDERS AND SOMETIMES THE GUY
IF A GUY FRIENDZONES A GIRL, IT'S HER FAULT TO THE OUTSIDERS AND SOMETIMES THE GUY

THE REASON FRIENDZONING IS SEXIST IS BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING THE GIRL MOST OF THE TIME

really guys, man up and accept that this term is sexist and you need to stop firetrucking using it
even if you dont see it as negative, it is, and if you're not an asshole who acts this way, good for you, now stop using the term, grow up and move on.

you wanna know the truth? this society firetrucking hates women
when a woman gets raped, she is asked if she was drunk. she is asked if she was wearing revealing clothing. she is asked if she led the man on in anyway. she asked all sorts of questions that put the blame on her.
when a woman is embracing of her sexuality, she is called a slut and she is shamed but this hardly happens to men.
when a woman gets pregnant, everyone is expecting her to carry the baby whether she wants to or not and if she doesn't, she is seen as a monster because she decided to choose what she wanted to do with her body.
women are seen as a prize to many men, i mean in cartoons and comics and movies, the guy always gets the girl as sort of a reward doesn't he?
after saving her life a couple of times, it's natural she falls for him right? it's like his reward to saving her and being nice to her.
this is where the sexism of friendzoning comes up
a guy doesn't get the reward he wants, the reward he was promised for being nice and good to a girl and he's mad
he's mad that a girl can make her own decisions

i am in no way saying all guys are like this
but it happens
and that's why it's wrong


honestly the only reason anyone should get worked up about this is if they have acted this way and have blamed a girl for friendzoning them and they're scared that a girl is actually calling them out for their wrong doings.

I was in what you would call a friendzone, I told her I liked her, she didn't like me back.

Am I mad at her? Do I blame her? The answer is NO, and why should I?

It's not her fault she doesn't like me.

this is how it should be
but the way it is interpreted in society and the negative connotations behind a girl friendzoning a guy (and it still being her fault) is what makes it bad.

[Naught]

I am a guy, and I am gonna start off by saying this: I agree with most of Koko's points.

One point I don't agree on, however, is that friendzoning is sexist.

THE REASON FRIENDZONING IS SEXIST IS BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING THE GIRL MOST OF THE TIME

really guys, man up and accept that this term is sexist and you need to stop firetrucking using it
even if you dont see it as negative, it is, and if you're not an asshole who acts this way, good for you, now stop using the term, grow up and move on.

I think it all has to do with opinion and context. For example, the school I go to is roughly 50-50 boys and girls, and I try to have a healthy relationship with both guys and girls. But when it comes to friendzoning, I would say that in my experiences, girls and guys are as bad as each other.

I have had guys friendzone girls, and the girls have all gone around gossiping that he is a man-whore and saying other things that ruin his reputation.
At the same time I have had guys friendzone girls, and the girls have just supported each other and there was no rudeness involved.
I have seen the same for the reverse.
I have had girls friendzone guys, and the guys have said that the girls are sluts and whores.
And at the same time I have seen girls friendzone guys, and the guys have just stuck be each other and pulled through it, with no derogatory terms being used against girls.

So I think it all depends about context. It is probably different for you, but this is what it is like where I live.

Also just because in most cases the girl is blamed, doesn't mean it is sexist.
To use an extreme example, if, on a similar large scale, a majority of people decided they wanted to jump off cliffs and commit suicide, does that mean that committing suicide is the right thing to do?
Just because a majority is involved, doesn't mean that a thing is wrong or right, sexist or not sexist.

I don't think that friendzoning is sexist, I just think that what happens because of friendzoning is sexist.
Because I have seen it first hand for both guys and girls. Friendzoning has sometimes caused sexism towards girls, it has sometimes caused sexism towards guys, and it has sometimes caused no sexism whatsoever.

So, I think that people should stop getting blamed and verbally abused because of friendzoning, whether you be a guy or a girl, because it happens to both sides. There will be people who don't like you, deal with it and move on, just don't deal with it the wrong way.

[legendkiller222]

you are missing the point lmao
it's not how it's handled because a girl can handle it perfectly fine while the guy is the one getting mad for no reason
or a girl can handle it like shit and the guy gets mad
either way
no matter how a girl handles it
if the guy gets pissed off, it's her fault, whether the guy is being rational or not
that is why it's sexist
and it has nothing to do with if the guy is good enough for the girl or not
like madotsuki said, stop being self centered
it's not about the guy all the time
and this is how your taking it
saying that being friendzoned is like being told you're not good enough for them is extremely self centered and you arent even acknowledging why the girl rejected you
you're automatically assuming you're not good enough
and you know how some people take that?
they take it as the girl being a snobby bitch who thinks she's better than anyone
now i said some, not all
but it's true
NO MATTER HOW YOU SEE IT
IF A GIRL FRIENDZONES A GUY, IT'S HER FAULT TO THE OUTSIDERS AND SOMETIMES THE GUY
IF A GUY FRIENDZONES A GIRL, IT'S HER FAULT TO THE OUTSIDERS AND SOMETIMES THE GUY

THE REASON FRIENDZONING IS SEXIST IS BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING THE GIRL MOST OF THE TIME

really guys, man up and accept that this term is sexist and you need to stop firetrucking using it
even if you dont see it as negative, it is, and if you're not an asshole who acts this way, good for you, now stop using the term, grow up and move on.

you wanna know the truth? this society firetrucking hates women
when a woman gets raped, she is asked if she was drunk. she is asked if she was wearing revealing clothing. she is asked if she led the man on in anyway. she asked all sorts of questions that put the blame on her.
when a woman is embracing of her sexuality, she is called a slut and she is shamed but this hardly happens to men.
when a woman gets pregnant, everyone is expecting her to carry the baby whether she wants to or not and if she doesn't, she is seen as a monster because she decided to choose what she wanted to do with her body.
women are seen as a prize to many men, i mean in cartoons and comics and movies, the guy always gets the girl as sort of a reward doesn't he?
after saving her life a couple of times, it's natural she falls for him right? it's like his reward to saving her and being nice to her.
this is where the sexism of friendzoning comes up
a guy doesn't get the reward he wants, the reward he was promised for being nice and good to a girl and he's mad
he's mad that a girl can make her own decisions

i am in no way saying all guys are like this
but it happens
and that's why it's wrong


honestly the only reason anyone should get worked up about this is if they have acted this way and have blamed a girl for friendzoning them and they're scared that a girl is actually calling them out for their wrong doings.






this is how it should be
but the way it is interpreted in society and the negative connotations behind a girl friendzoning a guy (and it still being her fault) is what makes it bad.

That is not true that friendzone is a sexist term. Because both people can do it. A guy can friendzone a girl. The point being is that humans have human emotions and part of being human can be acting irrational or getting mad that someone rejected you. However, the term friendzone is perfectly fine because it does not refer to a woman or a man. I don't view it as the girl's fault if the guy handles it bad and the girl told him nicely. But its understandable to be angry at first. People feel hurt when the person they like does not feel the same way. Plus girls feel the same way, unless now girls have evolved past emotions that every human has had since the beginning of time. Being angry at someone for not liking you is acceptable for a limited amount of time, but it is a healthy human emotion. It isn't selfish to feel bad. It's called being human.

I feel like not in this day and age when the word "friendzone" cannot be used we are living in this sheltered environment that neglects the fact that we as humans act irrational and have emotions. It may not be right to have hate towards a person who doesn't like you, but everybody does it. It doesn't last forever (or shouldn't).
If the situation directly involves you, it is not being self-centered to think about it in terms of yourself. People do this with everything. Your parents say no to something and you take it personally. Your teacher calls you out because you are talking in class. Your boss yells at you at work. It's perfectly normal and healthy for a human to look inward in a situation like this.

Also you bring up issues that have to do women that have nothing to do with this argument. Women being expected to carry a child is not the reason friendzoning is sexist or not sexist, the same goes with rape. Those are separate issues that you are tying into sexism, and are only valid discussing sexism, but not if friendzoning is sexist.

And again this is all experience based. The original post had no research done it was just her experience which may not be the norm. However, nice guys that become jerks aren't really jerks sometimes they get pushed to be a jerk. People have emotions and they have limits to how nice they will be and how much they are willing to put up with stuff that upsets them.

Edited by legendkiller222, 09 April 2012 - 12:15 PM.

[Koko]

That is not true that friendzone is a sexist term. Because both people can do it. A guy can friendzone a girl.

did everything i typed go over your head
yes a guy can friend zone a girl
guess what, according to society, it's still her fault for being clingy.

The point being is that humans have human emotions and part of being human can be acting irrational or getting mad that someone rejected you. However, the term friendzone is perfectly fine because it does not refer to a woman or a man.

that last sentence is where you are wrong. it's not fine just because both men and women say it. is the n word not a racist term because black and white people use it? of course it's a firetrucking racist term. you can't deny that. excuse me for my language, but by your logic, that is what you're saying.

I don't view it as the girl's fault if the guy handles it bad and the girl told him nicely. But its understandable to be angry at first. People feel hurt when the person they like does not feel the same way. Plus girls feel the same way, unless now girls have evolved past emotions that every human has had since the beginning of time. Being angry at someone for not liking you is acceptable for a limited amount of time, but it is a healthy human emotion. It isn't selfish to feel bad. It's called being human.

of course you can feel bad
i never said you couldnt
it's when you act like you deserved something and you make the girl feel like shit is when it becomes bad
and while you dont view it as the girls' fault, many do.

I feel like not in this day and age when the word "friendzone" cannot be used we are living in this sheltered environment that neglects the fact that we as humans act irrational and have emotions. It may not be right to have hate towards a person who doesn't like you, but everybody does it. It doesn't last forever (or shouldn't).
If the situation directly involves you, it is not being self-centered to think about it in terms of yourself. People do this with everything. Your parents say no to something and you take it personally. Your teacher calls you out because you are talking in class. Your boss yells at you at work. It's perfectly normal and healthy for a human to look inward in a situation like this.

i agree
but the point is
you don't make someone feel like shit
you don't belittle someone's choice
just because YOU FEEL LIKE SHIT

Also you bring up issues that have to do women that have nothing to do with this argument. Women being expected to carry a child is not the reason friendzoning is sexist or not sexist, the same goes with rape. Those are separate issues that you are tying into sexism, and are only valid discussing sexism, but not if friendzoning is sexist.

i was simply stating the truth, which you wanted
and i never said they had to do anything with friendzoning
theyre just some of the attacks on women
and friendzoning is another, more subtle attack

And again this is all experience based. The original post had no research done it was just her experience which may not be the norm. However, nice guys that become jerks aren't really jerks sometimes they get pushed to be a jerk. People have emotions and they have limits to how nice they will be and how much they are willing to put up with stuff that upsets them.

it doesnt firetrucking matter if it's experienced based
let's go back to racism
only minorities experienced racism
it is experienced based
it is what they went through

today racism still exists
if a black person told you a story about how something is racist, BASING IT ON MANY THINGS NOT JUST EXPERIENCE, would you shrug it off and say 'it's not racist lol it's just your experienced'
no

and yes people have limits
but when someone tells you to stop
you should be smart enough to stop

and that's what i'm telling all of the internalized misogynists
STOP

[shadowblade]

Everyone calm the firetruck down.Look if a girl(or guy sees you as only a friend)it doesnt mean you are friendzoned.I do agree with koko though it is bs. But heres the thing;its up to the the two people in question. Me and Alex are unfortunately just friends today but who knows maybe she'll dump her guy and then fall for me.It doesnt mean im friendzoned,it just means she don't see me that way. and for those of you who are probably thinking shes a slut bite your firetrucking tounge. We're not on the greatest terms but we're still great friends and if thats how it has to stay fine then im happy she found her soulmate.but anyway the friendzone is teenage bs they drive into your head in high school once you get older you'll stop worrying about that garbage.

[Tom]

What a clusterfiretruck. Koko, you sure love your controversial topics discuss, because we got an order of butthurt here. Just when I thought I could play dead on this site.

Meh, I guess I'll leave a response here, but then again I'll probably have to come back because someone thinks I'm an arrogant punk and tries to argue with bullshit responses because you know AN OPINION IS TOO MUCH TO HANDLE HINT HINT.

Ah ok. So friendzoning. A coined term often used too many times. Usually best described with girls trying to find boyfriends and her guy friends trying to date her, but she rejects him and just wants to stay friends, thus the friendzone. I know, you don't say.

But onto my main point. If girls want to friendzone guys for whatever reason....then so be it. Obviously she isn't friendzoning guys for no reason. If she feels nothing for the person who wants to date her, then she isn't going to date him. Why force yourself to date someone you're not interested in? I think that was common knowledge, but I didn't think many people were too firetrucking stupid to comprehend that, or I don't understand humans anymore.

Sure I get it, it's pretty ridiculous when a girl who has a lot of things in common with the guy and yet still friendzones him. And yeah it does seem silly that she goes off with asshats and people who will probably use her for his personal gains, and ignores the nice guy. But that's her choice. She is a person that's you know, DIFFERENT. She isn't going to have the same expectations as you. She may not only be of a different gender, but she has a different way of thinking.

If she doesn't like you, plain and simple. Don't make her out to be a slut. I mean, weren't you two friends before the whole friendzoning? What happened there? Decided that her titties meant more to you than her what she truly is? Come on now.

I think too many people don't get it. You know that it's not just girls who friendzone guys right? There are guys that can friendzone girls too. It's like rape. Girls can rape guys too, it isn't a one way ticket. I'm already in the process of friendzoning my ex, who will not stop clinging onto me, and let me find girls that I personally want to date. I did have feelings for her, but now I don't, especially after she tried to cheat on me before. And she has to accept it. Has she? Nope.

Think about people in your lifetime. Have any of you guys have friendzoned ANYBODY? You probably did, but you didn't realize it, did you? UGH THAT GIRL IS SO ICKY I DONT WANT TO DATE HER, BUT HEY WE CAN STILL BE FRIENDS, I SUPPOSE. Hmmmm, I seen it before.

The term friendzone isn't technically sexiest. But it's what you people making it out of to be. If all you're thinking of it as the girl rejects a nice guy and goes with an asshat, then of course it's going to be sexiest because you don't see the other side of this whole friendzone phenomena. Basically...it can happen to anyone, but when you use it to target a specific gender, then you're just an idiot.

Yeah I think that's all I got to say, for now.I can argue more points, but I believe this is sufficient.

Also, drop the racism. Stop trying to mix racism and sexism together. You're creating more conversational shit that isn't relating to the true topic. Quite frankly, if you're going to argue a good point, at least don't look like a douchebag doing it.

[Koko]

I agree with you on a lot of points Tom, but the reason it is sexist because there is going to be connotation that girl friendzones a guy, she's a bitch/slut/etc. And it is used to shame the girl for saying no because god forbid she says no. Just like god forbid she says yes.
that's why it's sexist
I understand not everyone thinks that way
I understand not everyone acts that way
The point is, that there are people that do and continuing to use the term as if it's not something wrong is just allowing them to do so as well, at least the way I see it.


And the reason that I brought up racism was because legendkillers argument that 'both genders use it' was completely flawed and I was using it to back up my point.

[legendkiller222]

did everything i typed go over your head
yes a guy can friend zone a girl
guess what, according to society, it's still her fault for being clingy.

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that last sentence is where you are wrong. it's not fine just because both men and women say it. is the n word not a racist term because black and white people use it? of course it's a firetrucking racist term. you can't deny that. excuse me for my language, but by your logic, that is what you're saying.

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of course you can feel bad
i never said you couldnt
it's when you act like you deserved something and you make the girl feel like shit is when it becomes bad
and while you dont view it as the girls' fault, many do.

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i agree
but the point is
you don't make someone feel like shit
you don't belittle someone's choice
just because YOU FEEL LIKE SHIT


i was simply stating the truth, which you wanted
and i never said they had to do anything with friendzoning
theyre just some of the attacks on women
and friendzoning is another, more subtle attack



it doesnt firetrucking matter if it's experienced based
let's go back to racism
only minorities experienced racism
it is experienced based
it is what they went through

today racism still exists
if a black person told you a story about how something is racist, BASING IT ON MANY THINGS NOT JUST EXPERIENCE, would you shrug it off and say 'it's not racist lol it's just your experienced'
no

and yes people have limits
but when someone tells you to stop
you should be smart enough to stop

and that's what i'm telling all of the internalized misogynists
STOP

Alright I have been as polite as possible, but you are being so immature and just an angsty teen, who really has yet to even understand how the world works (That is for being so impolite when I am only trying to let you understand that there are a few things that can be disagreed with and that you cannot generalize a segment of the population without actual facts).

There are so many fallacies that you are putting up as supposed truths. First, racism can be experienced by all races, but it is most commonly experienced by the minority race in a population (that can be a white kid in a black school as well). Second the n word is completely different than "friendzone" because the n word means something negative about a group of people, but both men and women "friendzone". It could very well possibly be commonly used to define what a woman did, but it happens more with women because men pursue women more than women pursue men (This is evident in nature. The male pursues the female more often). If I say oh I'm in the friend zone with a girl its about me and is not insulting me where as if I were to say I am a n word or my friend is a n word or that guy is a n word that is something negative because of the connotation it has around it. "Friendzone" does not mean anything bad it just means that you are friends with someone you sought to be more than friends with.Third you have no real facts that the term is sexist. This is the same as I to say that all girls that are teenagers are overly emotional because my experiences and the experiences of a few others around me back that up while at the same time ignoring the fact that this is all personal experience. Fourth and most importantly you do not have any evidence of anything. When have you post data from studies or trials that have successfully and repeatedly linked friendzoning to sexism against women that is when you can really argue this. This isn't a truth that is widely known or accepted it is a claim that you are making, which is vastly different than the n word being a racist term. Yes guys can be dicks to girls who "friendzone" them and blame them, but girls can be the same way. You ignored any actual argument I made and chose to pick out a sentence and argue you which is not giving what I even said context.

Also it can be argued that when a woman is pregnant it is both the man and the woman's baby because of the fact if the baby is delivered then the man is expected to support it, also the fact that a man is needed to have a kid. By the way there is also a question of a destroying a life before it has a chance (this is different than the day after pill/ birth control because someone is actually in the process of producing a child). That is not to say a woman doesn't have a right to an abortion, but if the man is around then she should discuss it with him because it is also his kid.

You can be angry that some guys are jerks, but some girls are bitches. You can be mad at inequality among men and women in various areas of life, but you have to understand what eliminating certain terms do. But if you curtail even the most harmless word like "friendzone" then you are setting precedent to eliminate a vast majority of the English language from being used in the public forum. You are also eliminating free speech because even hateful words, actual ones like the n word are still allowed because we have free speech unless it threatens someone or a group directly. "Friendzone" is something that both sexes do and both say. Girls could (no evidence to prove it) even use it less, but they still define it the situation the same way as someone using "friendzone".

Before you counter my argument remember as the person making the claim you have to support your argument with actual evidence and fact. Not just emotional banter that generalizes this because of experiences of a select few.

[Koko]

Alright I have been as polite as possible, but you are being so immature and just an angsty teen, who really has yet to even understand how the world works (That is for being so impolite when I am only trying to let you understand that there are a few things that can be disagreed with and that you cannot generalize a segment of the population without actual facts).There are so many fallacies that you are putting up as supposed truths. First, racism can be experienced by all races, but it is most commonly experienced by the minority race in a population (that can be a white kid in a black school as well). Second the n word is completely different than "friendzone" because the n word means something negative about a group of people, but both men and women "friendzone". It could very well possibly be commonly used to define what a woman did, but it happens more with women because men pursue women more than women pursue men (This is evident in nature. The male pursues the female more often). If I say oh I'm in the friend zone with a girl its about me and is not insulting me where as if I were to say I am a n word or my friend is a n word or that guy is a n word that is something negative because of the connotation it has around it. "Friendzone" does not mean anything bad it just means that you are friends with someone you sought to be more than friends with.Third you have no real facts that the term is sexist. This is the same as I to say that all girls that are teenagers are overly emotional because my experiences and the experiences of a few others around me back that up while at the same time ignoring the fact that this is all personal experience. Fourth and most importantly you do not have any evidence of anything. When have you post data from studies or trials that have successfully and repeatedly linked friendzoning to sexism against women that is when you can really argue this. This isn't a truth that is widely known or accepted it is a claim that you are making, which is vastly different than the n word being a racist term. Yes guys can be dicks to girls who "friendzone" them and blame them, but girls can be the same way. You ignored any actual argument I made and chose to pick out a sentence and argue you which is not giving what I even said context.Also it can be argued that when a woman is pregnant it is both the man and the woman's baby because of the fact if the baby is delivered then the man is expected to support it, also the fact that a man is needed to have a kid. By the way there is also a question of a destroying a life before it has a chance (this is different than the day after pill/ birth control because someone is actually in the process of producing a child). That is not to say a woman doesn't have a right to an abortion, but if the man is around then she should discuss it with him because it is also his kid.You can be angry that some guys are jerks, but some girls are bitches. You can be mad at inequality among men and women in various areas of life, but you have to understand what eliminating certain terms do. But if you curtail even the most harmless word like "friendzone" then you are setting precedent to eliminate a vast majority of the English language from being used in the public forum. You are also eliminating free speech because even hateful words, actual ones like the n word are still allowed because we have free speech unless it threatens someone or a group directly. "Friendzone" is something that both sexes do and both say. Girls could (no evidence to prove it) even use it less, but they still define it the situation the same way as someone using "friendzone".Before you counter my argument remember as the person making the claim you have to support your argument with actual evidence and fact. Not just emotional banter that generalizes this because of experiences of a select few.

The n word is used to shame black people.The friendzone is used to shame women.As well, you can't be racist against a white person. You can be discriminatory, predjudice, etc, but not racist, and that's entirely different topic, excuse me for diverging from the original topic.Now off racismYou guys are not getting the big pictureYou guys are seeing this in your own point of view which is fine and dandy because you're a guy and you don't see the negativity of the friendzone from your side.Okay, visualizeYou are a girlThere's a guy that likes you but you don't like him as anything more than a friend.


He asks you out, you say no because it is your choice.


Later, people start saying things about you.


People call you a slut, a whore, a bitch, say you weren't even worth his time. They make you feel like shit for your choice.This is where it comes down to.A choice.As I've said many times, friendzoning is vilifying a woman's right to say no.That's why it's sexist.
Have you posted any data? Any actual facts?
Stop trying to make me seem like I'm in the wrong because I don't have facts.
You don't either. It's one opinion against another.
How about we all shut up and watch this smart GUY talk about how it is sexist











I think this guy explained it a lot better than I do.

And actually this points how it can be negative for both parties, which I haven't touched because I am not a man and therefor do not have that point of view.