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Should Braig end up becoming the True Final Boss of KH3?


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#1 Finn and vigor

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 10:21 PM

As someone who really loves Xigbar enough to say he's my favorite character in the franchise, I gotta say, How would you feel if Braig ended up being the Final Boss of KH3? As of right now I'm going through many theories involving the possibility of Brain/Blaine ending up being Braig before his encounter with Xehanort (I've made a couple detailed discussions of how it could go about so you can find that around here on the forums in the UC section somewhere). So with that in mind, I have a feeling there is more to Braig's character then we think. Because I don't believe for a second that Braig's motivation for helping Xehanort was so that he could "Obtain a Keyblade" for himself. If that is the main cause however, what if there's more to that reasoning than meets the eye? Consider this quote here: "That thing there, it's called the Keyblade isn't it? Yup it seems these days everyone's got one of those". We'd all assume this was for a comedy reason but what if Braig was referring to the days where "everyone had a Keyblade" that being the Keyblade War? (again leading onto him being Brain) My point is though is that I have a slight feeling that Braig is gonna backstab Xehanort at the end of KH3. And to add onto that, what if he "was" gonna backstab him at some time before? If we're assuming Braig is Brain and with the (almost) confirmation that Brain and Lauraim were in cahoots in UC, what if Xigbar sent Marluxia to obtain Ventus for themselves? Xigbar was asking Zexion about the Chamber of Repose so maybe he got that info out of him eventually and tasked Marly to obtain the "prize'. This could give us a reasoning for Marluxia's betrayal to the Organization as maybe Xigbar had Marluxia do the dirty work so that Xemnas wouldn't look at him with suspicion. Speaking of Zexion, I find it weird how Xigbar was even asking Zexion about the CoR in the first place. Did Ienzo know something about it too? (Leading onto another theory of Braig and Ienzo being connected to Brain/Blaine in some way). But back to the Braig betraying Xehanort thing, what would you feel if this happened? Honestly I would feel disappointed if Xehanort's villainy gets diminished with the possibility of him being a vessal of the MoM (please don't do that square) but if it ends up being that Braig snipes Xehanort at the end thus starting the Final Battle, then "The Clever Little Sneak" would forever be best Badass Antagonist lol. (Sadly though, I can tell you guys are thinking "As If" right now)


Edited by Finn and vigor, 11 October 2017 - 10:22 PM.


#2 Rey Starkiller

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 10:58 PM

I highly doubt it. Even if Xigbar was planning on betraying Xehanort, I feel like Xehanort would have a back-up plan for any of his new Organization turning on him.

I also don't think that Braig is Brain anyway, but whatever.

It would be interesting at least for Xigbar to pull a last minute betrayal, be the final boss, and after his defeat, go back in time with Xehanort's Keyblade, thus becoming the Master of Masters (which I also doubt but whatever). That's the only way I could see that working out.



#3 Dio Brando

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 02:49 AM

No.Just no

 

Why would they bother building up Xehanort for aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall those games only to have him replaced by what's essentially his "sidekick"

 

Personal preference doesn't justify this in the slightest.Sure Xigbar\Braig is entertaining but it'd be super stupid for him to suddenly come out after beating Xehanort and be like

 



#4 Mysterious Figure

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 05:26 AM

We've spent pretty much the entire series building up Xehanort I'd be really disappointed if anyone but him is the final boss

#5 BaeWulf95

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 07:38 AM

Pretty much what everyone else is saying here. This IS the end to the Xehanort saga, wouldn't exactly feel right for the final boss to be someone other than Xehanort himself. Though I don't disagree with a betrayal on the ol' farts end, that'd be interesting. In fact, I've got my own ideas of who it might be, but right now it's just a silent wish.



#6 KingdomHearts3

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 07:58 AM

No way in hell this will happen. It's the Dark Seeker saga or Xehanort saga meaning Xehanort is the one that start it all and it all will be finished with him. Having Xigbar as the final boss makes no sense at all.

#7 Headphone Jack

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:12 AM

that'd be pretty hilarious for Xehanort, the big bad of the entire series, the supposed mastermind genius who always has a backup plan, to get killed just by being sniped in the back. 



#8 Iamkingdomhearts1000

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 01:59 PM

Nah, maybe the Penultimate Boss though.



#9 Finn and vigor

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 06:17 PM

We've spent pretty much the entire series building up Xehanort I'd be really disappointed if anyone but him is the final boss

Well, what I meant was that we kill or weaken Xehanort but it turns out Braig is still alive and he reveals his true plans. I'm not saying that Braig should quote on quote: Betray Xeahnort, just after his death take that chance to obtain KH for himself. But I'm only saying this out of nowhere, it mainly stems from the hint in Re:coded implying Braig has his "Own" plans. Although I do agree with a lot of you that it could diminish Xehanort as a villain but I  honestly feel like if Square does it right where it doesn't destroy Xehanort's arc as the Main Villain then I think it could flow pretty well. 


Edited by Finn and vigor, 12 October 2017 - 06:18 PM.


#10 IAMME

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 07:46 PM

Xigbar did not use marluxia to go after ventus in the chamber of awakening.  Marluxia betrayed org 13 because he wanted to overthrow it, and he always wanted the keyblade's power for himself.  Besides, xemnas already knew who the traitors were, so he would have known about xigbar.



#11 Dagesh Lene

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 03:05 AM

Consider this quote here: "That thing there, it's called the Keyblade isn't it? Yup it seems these days everyone's got one of those". We'd all assume this was for a comedy reason but what if Braig was referring to the days where "everyone had a Keyblade" that being the Keyblade War?

 

I don't follow your logic here.  I don't see how this could be taken in that way.  To me, it seems as logical as someone saying, "I am so tired," and someone who overhears them saying in response, "You must be referring to one of the other times that you were tired."  Plus, usually, when Xigbar/Braig refers to something from his past, he is very clear about it.  For example, "You don't look like you're half the hero the others were," or, "Of all the faces...Why do I look at her and see yours?"  This quote doesn't seem to have any implications at all that he is referring to something from his past.  It might imply that he has been around long enough to know of a time when even fewer people had a Keyblade, but that's it.  However, if I am missing your point, could you please tell me what you meant?

 

My point is though is that I have a slight feeling that Braig is gonna backstab Xehanort at the end of KH3.

 

I actually believe that he is too, or at least that he will try too.  In Back Cover, Gula talks to Ava about what is written on the Lost Page.  He says to her, "It contains a passage about an inevitable betrayal.  It talks about, 'the one who bears the sigil.'"  I personally think that this is foreshadowing a betrayal in Kingdom Hearts III.  I think that one of the foretellers' mistakes was thinking that the Book of Prophecies only foretold what was going to happen in their lifetimes.  If part of Luxu's mission was to find a worthy apprentice to pass "No Name" down to, and for Luxu's apprentice to do the same so that the Master of Master's eye could see the future, that would imply that the Book of Prophecies foretells far more than just the events leading up to the Keyblade War (I think that becomes more apparent since the Medals and the worlds we visit were both created by using the Book of Prophecies, and the Medals and worlds showed us characters that did not exist yet).  If that is true, then the final entry in the Book of Prophecies must be foretelling another world-ending event that hasn't happened yet (this might also imply that the Master of Masters left some stuff out of the Book of Prophecies, since apparently, the foretellers were not aware of there being more than one world-ending event).  I think that this is also backed up by the fact that, in many of the Kingdom Hearts III trailers, Young Xehanort is reciting the final entry in the Book of Prophecies to Young Eraqus, which seems to imply that Young Xehanort does not think that the world-ending event has happened yet.  So, if the Book of Prophecies foretells more than just the events leading up to the Keyblade War, then it is extremely likely that the inevitable betrayal is yet to happen (unless it happens in Union Cross).  And I think that the betrayal is likely to come from within the seekers of darkness, especially since many of them already bear a sigil, the Recusant's Sigil, in their Nobody names.  One of these Nobody names is Xigbar, and since Xigbar/Braig has shown many times that he is suspicious that Xehanort is hiding something, I think that he will be the most likely one to betray Xehanort.  However, I don't think that he will be the final boss.  Either he will try to betray Xehanort and fail, or he will seem to succeed, only to have Xehanort return in the end.

 

If we're assuming Braig is Brain and with the (almost) confirmation that Brain and Lauraim were in cahoots in UC, what if Xigbar sent Marluxia to obtain Ventus for themselves?

 

What "almost" confirmation are you talking about?  I can see a possibility, but it is not even close to being confirmed unless I have missed something.  And if I have indeed missed something, could you please tell me what it is?

 

Xigbar was asking Zexion about the Chamber of Repose so maybe he got that info out of him eventually and tasked Marly to obtain the "prize'.

 

Except if all Xigbar wanted was to find Ventus, then he had no reason to ask Zexion about the Chamber of Repose, because he seemed to already know that Ventus was in the Chamber of Waking, and finding out more information on the Chamber of Repose would not have helped him find the Chamber of Waking at all unless Xemnas was talking about its location in the Chamber of Repose, which he apparently wasn't, because no one has found it yet (as far as we know).

 

Speaking of Zexion, I find it weird how Xigbar was even asking Zexion about the CoR in the first place. Did Ienzo know something about it too? (Leading onto another theory of Braig and Ienzo being connected to Brain/Blaine in some way).

 

Two things here.  First, as you pointed out a few sentences earlier, wasn't Xigbar asking Zexion about the Chamber of Repose because he thought that Zexion did know something that he didn't know, specifically what Xemnas and the mysterious other were saying inside of it?  Second, I don't see how anyone could be Brain.  If Ventus and Lauriam existed at the time of Union Cross and haven't changed their identities, why would Brain change his identity to Braig or Ienzo?  I mean, there are definitely reasons for a person to change their identity, but since Union Cross was all like, "Look!  It's Ventus!" and "Look!  It's Marluxia as a human!" it doesn't seem like it is trying to hide who these characters are or that they existed at that time, so why wouldn't it do the same thing with Braig or Ienzo if one of them was a member of the new Union leaders too?


Edited by Dagesh Lene, 13 October 2017 - 03:34 AM.


#12 Finn and vigor

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 08:01 PM

I don't follow your logic here. I don't see how this could be taken in that way. To me, it seems as logical as someone saying, "I am so tired," and someone who overhears them saying in response, "You must be referring to one of the other times that you were tired." Plus, usually, when Xigbar/Braig refers to something from his past, he is very clear about it. For example, "You don't look like you're half the hero the others were," or, "Of all the faces...Why do I look at her and see yours?" This quote doesn't seem to have any implications at all that he is referring to something from his past. It might imply that he has been around long enough to know of a time when even fewer people had a Keyblade, but that's it. However, if I am missing your point, could you please tell me what you meant?



Response: I meant that Braig could have been poking fun around the fact that "These days everyones got a Keyblade" because he knew that at some point many people at one point in time had Keyblades. He could have been subconsciously referring to a time that "Everyone had Keyblades".




I actually believe that he is too, or at least that he will try too. In Back Cover, Gula talks to Ava about what is written on the Lost Page. He says to her, "It contains a passage about an inevitable betrayal. It talks about, 'the one who bears the sigil.'" I personally think that this is foreshadowing a betrayal in Kingdom Hearts III. I think that one of the foretellers' mistakes was thinking that the Book of Prophecies only foretold what was going to happen in their lifetimes. If part of Luxu's mission was to find a worthy apprentice to pass "No Name" down to, and for Luxu's apprentice to do the same so that the Master of Master's eye could see the future, that would imply that the Book of Prophecies foretells far more than just the events leading up to the Keyblade War (I think that becomes more apparent since the Medals and the worlds we visit were both created by using the Book of Prophecies, and the Medals and worlds showed us characters that did not exist yet). If that is true, then the final entry in the Book of Prophecies must be foretelling another world-ending event that hasn't happened yet (this might also imply that the Master of Masters left some stuff out of the Book of Prophecies, since apparently, the foretellers were not aware of there being more than one world-ending event). I think that this is also backed up by the fact that, in many of the Kingdom Hearts III trailers, Young Xehanort is reciting the final entry in the Book of Prophecies to Young Eraqus, which seems to imply that Young Xehanort does not think that the world-ending event has happened yet. So, if the Book of Prophecies foretells more than just the events leading up to the Keyblade War, then it is extremely likely that the inevitable betrayal is yet to happen (unless it happens in Union Cross). And I think that the betrayal is likely to come from within the seekers of darkness, especially since many of them already bear a sigil, the Recusant's Sigil, in their Nobody names. One of these Nobody names is Xigbar, and since Xigbar/Braig has shown many times that he is suspicious that Xehanort is hiding something, I think that he will be the most likely one to betray Xehanort. However, I don't think that he will be the final boss. Either he will try to betray Xehanort and fail, or he will seem to succeed, only to have Xehanort return in the end.

Response: Well the Final Boss thing is really just a wish lol (no big deal if it doesn't happen though)


What "almost" confirmation are you talking about? I can see a possibility, but it is not even close to being confirmed unless I have missed something. And if I have indeed missed something, could you please tell me what it is?

Response: I meant from this conversation here. Lauriam: "So what should we start with? Skuld: How about we decide the Unions? Ephemer: About that, i actually want to keep going for awhile without dividing up each Union. Brain: Hu~h Lauriam: I see.
Don't these reactions feel a little suspicious to you? (Like i said though, its only an assumption. Thats why i said "almost")

Except if all Xigbar wanted was to find Ventus, then he had no reason to ask Zexion about the Chamber of Repose, because he seemed to already know that Ventus was in the Chamber of Waking, and finding out more information on the Chamber of Repose would not have helped him find the Chamber of Waking at all unless Xemnas was talking about its location in the Chamber of Repose, which he apparently wasn't, because no one has found it yet (as far as we know).

Response: He already knew Ventus's location? Are we talking about "after" KH1? Cuz the conversation with Zexion and Xigbar from what i can tell takes place before the events of CoM or even KH1 ( as Xigbar states he found Marluxia, and at that time he was the newest member). Also keep in mind that Xigbar seemed to Not know much about CO within this conversation with him saying "What new facility? Oh you mean Castle Oblivion right?" But at some point he must have had found a way to find Ventus so heres my assumption on "how" Xigbar could have done it. Lets say it was around this time Terra-Xehanort got the information about Ventus's location from Aqua (within 0.2 and before Micky finds her). Now here begs the question: How did Terra-Xehanort appear before Aqua? Remember Xemnas's strange conversations between Aqua's armor? In KH2 it was stated Xemnas built a room in Radiant Garden and talked with that empty piece of armor. What if this was how Terra Xehanort found Aqua in the Realm of Darkness? He did it through Aqua's empty armor? But how would Xigbar get this information you say? Well it was stated that Xigbar would "Listen in" on those conversations. What if Xigbar overheard that conversation between Xemnas and Aqua (the Aqua in the RoD) and with this information, asked Marluxia to obtain Ventus for themselves?

Two things here. First, as you pointed out a few sentences earlier, wasn't Xigbar asking Zexion about the Chamber of Repose because he thought that Zexion did know something that he didn't know, specifically what Xemnas and the mysterious other were saying inside of it? Second, I don't see how anyone could be Brain. If Ventus and Lauriam existed at the time of Union Cross and haven't changed their identities, why would Brain change his identity to Braig or Ienzo? I mean, there are definitely reasons for a person to change their identity, but since Union Cross was all like, "Look! It's Ventus!" and "Look! It's Marluxia as a human!" it doesn't seem like it is trying to hide who these characters are or that they existed at that time, so why wouldn't it do the same thing with Braig or Ienzo if one of them was a member of the new Union leaders too?



Response: Your right about Brain changing his identity though. Thats one thing i can't really figure out. Although i do have 1 possible explanation but if i discussed that here, it'd take too long lol.

Edited by Finn and vigor, 14 October 2017 - 08:03 PM.


#13 Dagesh Lene

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:31 PM

Before I begin, thank's for responding to my questions!  It did help me understand what you meant.

 

You said, "I meant that Braig could have been poking fun around the fact that 'These days everyones got a Keyblade' because he knew that at some point many people at one point in time had Keyblades. He could have been subconsciously referring to a time that 'Everyone had Keyblades'."

 

I still think that that's a bit of a stretch, but it does help me to understand what you meant, so thanks for your response!

 

You also said, "I meant from this conversation here. Lauriam: 'So what should we start with? Skuld: How about we decide the Unions? Ephemer: About that, i actually want to keep going for awhile without dividing up each Union. Brain: Hu~h Lauriam: I see.

Don't these reactions feel a little suspicious to you? (Like i said though, its only an assumption. Thats why i said 'almost')"
 
Ok.  That makes more sense now.  But no, I don't think that their reactions seem suspicious.  They seem to just be reacting out of shock to what Ephemer said.  After all, Ephemer did just basically say that they should not follow the rules for a while.  Brain even said to him after he explained himself, "It was written as law that we are to divide them up, though.  You think it will be okay?"  This response of his makes me think further that he was just shocked to hear Ephemer suggest that they break the rules, and I think that all of their reactions were nothing but shock that he would suggest that, including Skuld's reaction.
 
You also said, "He already knew Ventus's location? Are we talking about 'after' KH1? Cuz the conversation with Zexion and Xigbar from what i can tell takes place before the events of CoM or even KH1 ( as Xigbar states he found Marluxia, and at that time he was the newest member)."
 
Yes, I think he did already know Ventus' location, because he said to Zexion about Castle Oblivion, "That's where he'll find his other 'friend.'"
 
You also said, "Also keep in mind that Xigbar seemed to Not know much about CO within this conversation with him saying 'What new facility? Oh you mean Castle Oblivion right?'"
 
On the contrary, he seems to know a bit about Castle Oblivion within this conversation.  He said to Zexion, "The Chamber of Repose is part of a pair.  The Chamber of Waking is the other.  Another graveyard, if you want to call it that.  It was constructed by someone other than Xemnas himself.  And that's where he'll find it."  So not only does he know that the Chamber of Waking was constructed by someone other than Xemnas, he also knows that it is located in Castle Oblivion.  However, you do bring up a good point.  It is possible that Xigbar learned all of this from eavesdropping on Xemnas.  However, I don't think that Xigbar learned it by eavesdropping on Xemnas while he was in the Chamber of Repose, because as Xigbar said, "Couldn't hear what they were saying."
 
You also said, "What if this was how Terra Xehanort found Aqua in the Realm of Darkness? He did it through Aqua's empty armor?"
 
I actually never thought of that.  You might be on to something.  However, it is also possible that since Terra was able to talk to Aqua because his heart had ties to the darkness, Xehanort was able to highjack the conversation since his heart was part of Terra's heart at that time, which also means, if this is what happened, that it is more likely that Ansem found out where Ventus was instead of Xemnas, because Ansem had Terra-Xehanort's heart within him while Xemnas did not.

Edited by Dagesh Lene, 14 October 2017 - 09:39 PM.


#14 Alan Smithee

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Posted 29 October 2017 - 08:38 PM

IMO, it would certainly be more interesting than just a predictable retread of BBS's final battle (looking at you, MX).


Edited by Alan Smithee, 29 October 2017 - 08:42 PM.


#15 AwesomeKHfan

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Posted 31 October 2017 - 02:39 PM

Sounds like a Naruto plot twist you build this character up for years just to replace him with another side character